Mathematical notation needs to be disrupted

๐ŸŽ™๏ธ ohoot ยท 388 points ยท Posted at 03:52:58 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)


HurtlesIntoTurtles ยท 97 points ยท Posted at 05:51:16 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

ฮปฮฟฮป ฮฝฮฟ ฮณฮตฮฝฮตฯฮนฮบฯƒ

LEmp_Evrey ยท 36 points ยท Posted at 06:09:30 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Thanks for not abusing greek as homoglyphs...

HurtlesIntoTurtles ยท 86 points ยท Posted at 06:15:43 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

ะงะพั†'ั“ั ัˆัlัะพะผั ัะพะผั“ะฐโ†ั

BadGoyWithAGun ยท 36 points ยท Posted at 08:30:44 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

chots ghe sheitsome tsomgade

[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 06:52:14 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Is there a script for this?

HurtlesIntoTurtles ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 07:04:27 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:11:03 on January 17, 2018 ยท (Permalink)

jajajajajaja

[deleted] ยท 37 points ยท Posted at 11:11:00 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

ฮ›ฮŸฮ› ฮฝฯŒฮฟฯ… ฯ„ฮถฮตฮฝฮญฯฮนฮบฯ‚

This is how "lol no generics" is phonetically written in greek (meaning the pronunciation sounds the same as in english)

r2d2_21 ยท 51 points ยท Posted at 12:57:25 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

trying to write English phonetically without taking accents into account

lol no linguistics

avaxzat ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 09:09:37 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

ฯ‡ฮฑฯ‡ฮฑฯ‡ฮฑฯ‡ฮฑ

quicknir ยท 76 points ยท Posted at 15:54:03 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Number of lines for a "long" body of work:

  • Math: 10 K lines ~ 200 pages is extreme
  • Code: over 1 million lines is common

Number of names unique to your project relevant in a given chunk of work:

  • Math: typically less than a dozen symbols, that are all rigorously defined at the top of the chunk.
  • Code: all your local variables, member variables if you're in a class method, all the namespaces/modules that you import, all the classes, methods and functions defined in those namespaces/modules: typically 100's, and often 1000's or more, of symbols in scope at once.

Number of times the same variable might be used as part of a one line expression:

  • Math: half a dozen times or more is typical in moderately complex formulas
  • Programming: once or twice

Complexity of expressions:

  • Math: often very high
  • Programming: low to very low

Number of times community has reversed its own consensus and implicitly admitted that it's full of shit:

  • Math: a handful of times in more than 2K years
  • Programming: hourly for the last 60 years.

Who understands the other field better:

  • Math: lots of people learn some programming for simulations. Half of the good programmers in NYC are ex math and physics PHDs.
  • Programmers: Think they're amazing at math if they know how a derivative works. And most don't.

Conclusion: yes please math community shut up and take notes from webshit because math and programming are exactly the same.

sabas123 ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 17:26:04 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

If I wasn't a poor student that is switching from cs to math, I would shower you in gold.

LAUAR ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 14:21:35 on October 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Conclusion: yes please math community shut up and take notes from webshit because math and programming are exactly the same.

Actually, this guy makes Minecraft mods.

tpgreyknight ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 22:40:50 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Fifouxxe ยท 119 points ยท Posted at 04:50:24 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

TIL greek alphabet is obscure and dead

spaghettiCodeArtisan ยท 61 points ยท Posted at 09:55:55 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

TIL greek alphabet is obscure and dead

It's not just greek alphabet, the integration symbol for example comes from medieval rendering of letter 's' (called 'Long s').

Or the del/nabla operator:

The nabla is a triangular symbol like an inverted Greek delta โˆ‡. The name comes, by reason of the symbol's shape, from the Hellenistic Greek word ฮฝฮฌฮฒฮปฮฑ for a Phoenician harp, and was suggested by the encyclopedist William Robertson Smith to Peter Guthrie Tait in correspondence.

Math often feels like an RPG game where each NPC and each item has a unique and half-forgotten lore to them that typically dates back at least a couple of centuries. Seems like math has side-quests in side-quests, in fact, it's probably side-quests all the way down.

BufferUnderpants ยท 58 points ยท Posted at 11:14:37 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

It's kind of like it was an academic discipline with thousands of years of history and which spans a diverse set of topics.

mapgazer ยท 27 points ยท Posted at 15:53:02 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

The similarities between mathematics and Dark Souls never end.

tpgreyknight ยท 33 points ยท Posted at 22:35:53 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

YOU DERIVED

aryanchaurasia ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 22:35:55 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
      D E R I V E D  
    / E         / E  
  /   R       /   R  
D E R I V E D     I  
E     V     E     V  
R     E     R     E  
I     D E R I V E D  
V   /       V   /    
E /         E /      
D E R I V E D        
tpgreyknight ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 22:43:32 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
   D E R I V E D
   E           E
   R           R
3  I           I
   V           V
   E           E
   D E R I V E D
aryanchaurasia ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 22:43:35 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
      D E R I V E D  
    / E         / E  
  /   R       /   R  
D E R I V E D     I  
E     V     E     V  
R     E     R     E  
I     D E R I V E D  
V   /       V   /    
E /         E /      
D E R I V E D        
vytah ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 01:38:46 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Amenemhab ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 08:47:56 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Tbh sometimes mathematicians also use Fraktur script, or Hebrew.

Fun fact btw: there's a separate unicode block for Fraktur letters, for use only in mathematics, where Fraktur letters have different semantics than regular Latin letters. When typesetting regular text, you should use the regular Latin code block with a Fraktur font. Isn't it fun ?

Fifouxxe ยท 25 points ยท Posted at 08:53:45 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

TIAL Hebrew alphabet is dead and obscure.

Amenemhab ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 09:00:53 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

It was kinda obscure when mathematicians started using it, but fair enough. :)

[deleted] ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 11:14:04 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Greek here :S

HurtlesIntoTurtles ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 11:24:20 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

It's $CURRENT_YEAR, get with the times and learn Lojban.

[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 13:50:42 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

what is greek :s

jacques_chester ยท 53 points ยท Posted at 11:29:41 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

โˆ€ j | j โˆ‹ uj

Yes, but it's historical. Mathematical notation is write-optimised and was largely invented by geniuses in a tearing great hurry to get to the point of whatever it is they'd discovered.

StallmanTheWhite ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 12:04:29 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

and was largely invented by geniuses in a tearing great hurry to get to the point of whatever it is they'd discovered.

Just like most software then.

slavik262 ยท 62 points ยท Posted at 15:28:40 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

No, they said geniuses.

Fmelons ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 12:24:26 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

for all j where uj belongs to j?

jacques_chester ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 23:41:08 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

For all lame set humour where Jacques is in the set of webscale developers

gott_modus ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 16:38:43 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

โˆ€ j | j โˆ‹ uj

nigga wat

KindaAgrees ยท 24 points ยท Posted at 18:17:49 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Translating into ASCII:

AjIjeuj

Hope this helps.

bah_si_en_fait ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 22:30:10 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

For all j, where j belongs to uj.

Solving for jerk is left as an exercise to the reader.

Someguy2020 ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 01:22:48 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

you flipped the in symbol.

bah_si_en_fait ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 16:16:14 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Sorry, made sense in my mind when translating it.

But then who are you to prevent me from disrupting mathematical notation too?

Shorttail0 ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 23:05:58 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Lol it's for all j, not for any j. For any is upside down E.

dunoid ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 03:49:41 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

I feel "for any" is so vague it could mean either one. This is why we should replace English with Rust

fasquoika ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 16:34:58 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Better yet, replace it with agda

ConcernedInScythe ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 19:37:25 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

For any is basically synonymous with for all, upside down e is there exists.

Shorttail0 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 20:24:54 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Oh wow, I'm retarded. Fuck.

Poddster ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 07:48:21 on September 15, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

upside down E

durr

Shorttail0 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 13:17:46 on September 15, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

E rotated 360 degrees?

gott_modus ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 22:55:57 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

thx

[deleted] ยท 69 points ยท Posted at 05:05:00 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

[deleted]

HotelDon ยท 61 points ยท Posted at 06:46:43 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

The variable names have to be short so the professor can pretend his midterm is actually completable in 90 minutes.

miauw62 ยท 24 points ยท Posted at 13:52:21 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

this but unironically. writing shit down in math already takes long enough without having to write out full words.

pythonesqueviper ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 00:41:49 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Every single fucking test about electrical formulae was like this. Formulae for electrical laws are long and take ages, so here's your obnoxiously long test with approximately 80 exercises. Have fun, fuccboi.

BufferUnderpants ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 11:18:32 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Like fuck, it's math, how are you supposed to understand it without an accompanying book chapter or paper? There's your documentation, better than you could accomplish with docstrings and "descriptive" variable names, which would commonly be contrivances that deviate from the actual source.

Someguy2020 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 01:21:25 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Especially because they tend to be fairly consistent.

tehtris ยท 49 points ยท Posted at 06:57:22 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

I work with data scientists. They literally cannot understand that a variable can have more than 3 characters.

Noughmad ยท 29 points ยท Posted at 08:27:41 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

I worked with actual scientists. Three characters is way too much. Also, mixed english and local names in code are great.

[deleted] ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 13:52:38 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Also python and all code in a single method is fundamental best practice.

Noughmad ยท 24 points ยท Posted at 14:08:23 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Thin was a different department, but I still have flashbacks of endless chains of

def __init__(self, **kwargs):
    self.__dict__.update(**kwargs)

Good luck trying to find where some value came from.

[deleted] ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 17:49:23 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Use this one weird trick and you will never need another type again.

Treyzania ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 16:48:41 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Oh my god.

tpgreyknight ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 22:38:15 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

why would you do this

gott_modus ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 16:41:00 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

all code in a single method is fundamental best practice

science!

shamrock-frost ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 08:23:11 on September 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

I once helped a physics major friend in Germany... His code had zeit and time variables in the same scope. It was also a visual basic form

SkaKri ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 20:58:21 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Ok guys, we have phi, psi and thet... fuck, we need to shorten it to Th.

hnerixh ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 18:28:04 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

I've written a style guide containing

Variables should be given short and useless names such as q, x or p.

crmd ยท 23 points ยท Posted at 09:43:49 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted] ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 11:13:17 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

I read that iMac's major and this is deep and started wondering what the fuck that sub is about.

AbjectMatterExpert ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 11:48:09 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Came here to say this. I was hoping for an iMac hipster bashing sub. oh well!

StallmanTheWhite ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 11:33:00 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

What is it supposed to say?

[deleted] ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 11:52:47 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

I am a CS major and this is deep.

gott_modus ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 16:29:21 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

same

r2d2_21 ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 12:43:01 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

imacs

emacs*

fasquoika ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 13:02:56 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

page not found

Damn

postman_ ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 08:10:54 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
statistmonad ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 08:37:48 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Thanks to Ed Kmett

This is how you know shit is about to get real.

[deleted] ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 13:54:01 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

This is some abstract shit dude

UsingYourWifi ยท 59 points ยท Posted at 07:19:57 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Can't jerk, 90% of the college kids I tutored were only having trouble because math nerds get off on making shit as terse and obscure as possible. They're more try-hard than even the most enthusiastic haskal leghumpers.

[deleted] ยท 21 points ยท Posted at 11:12:17 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

But what if a high jerk level mathematician learns haskal? Then we get the programming singularity.

BowserKoopa ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 17:51:23 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

(ะค) :: Int -> Int -> Int

gott_modus ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 16:27:23 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Math is at least difficult. Haskell leg-humpers seem to think what they do is hard when it's not.

shamrock-frost ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 08:21:41 on September 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

uhhh every hard of this thing called CATEGORY THEORY?????

#

Quaglek ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 08:42:30 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

I worked on code primarily written by mathematicians one summer. They do have a tendency to use unhelpfully terse variable names.

[deleted] ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 06:44:24 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Someone didn't study the notation of multiplication

[deleted] ยท 26 points ยท Posted at 13:03:04 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

[deleted]

jacques_chester ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 22:50:28 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Webshits are just jealous of our 300k starting at any job we want.

McDonald's really lifted their cashier game I see

gott_modus ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 06:20:11 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Right, and programming is totally math.

mapgazer ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 15:56:23 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Do you even Curry-Howard?

TheLastMeritocrat ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 12:32:36 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Fenastus ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 02:00:26 on September 13, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Well in programming in one "problem" you could have a shit load of different variables whereas in your typical math problem you might have a maximum of maybe 8-10 (not talking about the really really complicated theoretical shit)

ArgueWithMeAboutCorn ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 15:44:03 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

Oh yeah programmers then why do you write

   for int i=0

??? Checkmate atheists

skulgnome ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 12:36:22 on September 12, 2017 ยท (Permalink)

What are pos and len