mtyndall ยท 793 points ยท Posted at 18:26:59 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ah yes, the South Park approach
MurphJr ยท 682 points ยท Posted at 18:36:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think my favorite time South Park tried this was during the Nambla episode.
At the end if the episode one of the men give a speech about how pedophilia is a disease and that they can't help the way they act. They're misunderstood. There's a brief pause and then Stan goes
"Dude... you want to have sex with children..."
And then the cops arrest the guy. It's a great final conclusion.
What are you trying to say here? Because I have the feeling that you're ignoring a lot of not-so-subtle differences between homosexuality and pedophelia.
Mostly the part where the sex partner is old enough to consent, for starters.
Pedophilia != child molester, that's the distinction we are working with
oiducwa ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:26:10 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
True. The thing is in no way pedoโs desire can be satisfied in any degree. If weโre horny we have sex. No one is willing to have sex with me? Well I can watch some porn and jerk it off or use a doll. These can never happen for a pedo.
I am truly sorry some people are born wired that way.
Mostly the part where the sex partner is old enough to consent, for starters.
I don't see how that matters when judging the pedophiles. It's not like they asked to be attracted to kids, it's a sexual orientation like being gay or straight. However actually acting on it is a different matter all together.
Sure, but what happens when you try to normalize pedophilia? What happens when pedophiles gain mainstream acceptance? You think molestation would go down or up?
There is some argument it will go down because it encourages treatment. By making it comment stigmatized to even have those feelings, paedophiles hide that fact and thus avoid treatment.
Wtf no if the girl says no you dont do anything at all. The reason children cant give consent is because they are not fully developed and dont make logical decisions. So thats a no all the time which means you should never do it. I have no idea how that's hard to grasp
What im saying is being a pedophile is like being the most unattractive piece of neckbeard ever. It's "no" all the time.
Now is that actually not okey? Or should it be okey to have a sexuality, even if you never can have sex.
Just like being so unattractive that you could never ever have sex isn't illegal, and no one is going to suggest cutting your balls out or forcing you on hormones, should pedophilia in my opinion be treated the same way.
You would probably want to see a therapist at some point, just because inevitably that situation would suck. But being treated all the time as a potential criminal is both unfair and unhelpful. If anything, it could make you either be constantly ashamed of yourself and building your feelings, waiting to brust out, or even worse, make you accept yourself as this "animal". Both cases would drive you closer to committing a crime: having sex with someone without consent.
The reason for lack of consent consent doesn't change a thing in my opinion. It's exactly the same if the consent can not be given because the other party is underage, or if the other party just doesn't want to.
Being pedophile shouldn't be illegal, raping children should be illegal.
yeah, it isn't, but society treats pedophiles like they are already or will inevitably rape a child, if they find out. Politicians have seriously suggested outing personal information, similiar how sex offenders are listed in some places. Many therapists aren't willing to see pedophiles, and only few actually have sufficient gasp on the topic.
Instead of helping pedofiles to live normal lives, society pushes them out and treats them as dangerous animals. This obviously isn't an helpful method.
Nobody's saying we should let adults fuck kids, they're just acknowledging that it's an attraction they have no control over, which is true for both gays and pedophiles.
Are you comparing gay people to fucking pedophiles?
Yeah, why not? Both are sexual orientations, regardless of whom they are attracted to as they can't help it. Actually acting on it is a different topic, however.
[deleted] ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 22:01:45 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Then why not compare straight people with paedophiles? They're both just sexual orientations right?...
There's literally no reason to "compare" homosexuality and paedophilia in this context without some sort of implicit implication that homosexuality is some kind of deviant behaviour.
I could've easily used heterosexual people in place of homosexual but a) the people I was replying to were talking about homosexuals and paedophiles and b) heterosexual people don't suffer the same stigma so the comparison would've been pointless and empty.
They are two forms of sexual attraction that is out of a persons control. What is in their control is the ability to act on it, so you can absolutely compare homosexual attraction to pedophilia, but you cannot compare gay sex with child molestation.
[deleted] ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 20:55:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Thats what he is saying. It is never right to be attracted like that towards children, they cant give consent. If you are some reason attracted to children its not a "sexual prefernce," youre just sick.
No, however we can all agree being attracted to children is wrong on so many levels. We (hopefully) can all agree that there is a distinct difference between being attractedโ to an adult is acceptable and being attracted to a child is not.
Not a single person in this thread has said that being attracted to children is acceptable. You're arguing with a strawman while advocating that paedophiles (again, not child molesters) should be demonised instead of helped.
Dorocche ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 23:06:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And yet those sick people cant go get medical help because people are demonizing them for something utterly out of their control.
What is comparable between, a victimless relationship between two consenting adults (that happen to be of the same sex) and an adult having sex with a minor ?
Let's see the differences first.
Consent, one is consensual, the other by default cannot be consensual as a minor does not have the ability to consent.
One has no victim, other one has a de facto victim.
One involves love, the other does not. A minor by essence does not experience love the same way, this is the reason laws protect them and their consent.
Now what are similarities ?
It involves sex.
So according to you, using broad terms, like : illegal, would make it pertinent to compare torrenting a song and murdering a whole family.
I'm not actually. I understand him and the others are arguing using the difference between an attraction, and acting on it.
Except everything I said applies to the attraction just the same. I didn't use the term of illegal or any legal definition, because paedophilia is simply not illegal, it does not imply acting on it.
However that does not refute anything I said.
The attraction is still toward a different object than homosexuality, and all my points apply.
Pedophiles are indeed attracted to prepubescent, that still cannot consent, that are unable to reciprocate the love fully.
And if privatizing the thing didn't work, it must have been due to government interference. Clearly we must privatize more things until it starts working.
Oh and no taxes ever, but everything funded by taxes must remain free, can't have kids paying for public school or to drive on every street.
voksul ยท 27 points ยท Posted at 00:28:57 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Libertarian Economics:
Everything going to shit is an undesirable outcome for all parties, so they obviously wouldn't let everything go to shit. Forget market failures, friction, information asymmetry, and just plain old greed, nothing bad can ever happen in a libertarian paradise because bad things are bad.
Just in time, since you'll now have to pay a toll on every road
Sometimes. Although building a road has other advantages as well - it raises property values along them, allowing for commercial leasing. Offset the sales and gas taxes that are supposed to go to roads and probably don't and I bet there is savings.
and tuition for your kids
It already happens. I own a home and pay a decent amount of property tax. It has been shown that a student attending public school costs twice as much as one attending private, $6000 a head in public school versus $3000 in private. The reason private school are expensive is that you are forced to pay for public school - and if you send your kid to private the cost is added on top of what you already pay in tax. Offset the tax like we do in AZ and the math works.
And if privatizing the thing didn't work, it must have been due to government interference. Clearly we must privatize more things until it starts working.
I've heard them argue that employees are less likely to be of help if they work for the government than if they worked for a private business, because they have no incentive to keep a customers business.
Apparently none of those fucks have ever been to Walmart, because I've never seen an employee give a damn. The only people in the private sector that give a shit are the bosses and owners who actually profit from it, and they're going to cut as many damn corners as they can to make more.
The only people in the private sector that give a shit are the bosses and owners who actually profit from it
That's why I like things like ESOP. It passes the profits on to the employees and creates incentives to make the company do well. Of course, that doesn't really apply to cashiers at Walmart since they don't have anything like that.
Walmart has stock options. Dunno if it's an esop. Also has store performance based quarterly bonuses.
It's not much but it's something.
[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 22:15:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I've heard them argue that employees are less likely to be of help if they work for the government than if they worked for a private business, because they have no incentive to keep a customers business.
Apparently none of those fucks have ever been to Walmart, because I've never seen an employee give a damn. The only people in the private sector that give a shit are the bosses and owners who actually profit from it, and they're going to cut as many damn corners as they can to make more.
Well, you just answered yourself. Give the worker a piece of the action if they benefited the employer. People take better care of shit when they own it.
But why? What does the boss actually do that the employees can't? Wouldn't the employees do an even better job if they were doing something for them and not for some random rich asshole
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:55:01 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But why? What does the boss actually do that the employees can't? Wouldn't the employees do an even better job if they were doing something for them and not for some random rich asshole
Good management is essential to successful business. Prioritizing your effort is hard at entry level as you should be focusing on the individual tasks in detail, so having someone to direct is important.
vy2005 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 19:26:12 on October 19, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Are you saying the entire concept of management isnโt important?
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 03:19:04 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What's funnier is EVERY. SINGLE. FUCKING. PRESIDENTAL. ELECTION. they're convinced that running a candidate that inherently appeals to a small niche of the population will somehow win the plurality of votes and get along with Congress and accomplish what they want even when they haven't even won a single House or Senate seat before, or Governorship. The ones who aren't batshit insane ironically admit their true goal is to reach the 5% threshold to receive Federal funding in order to better their odds in the next election. Think about that for a second: a political party that's focused on limiting government aid and regulations has its primary electoral goal to get enough votes to get federal funding and debate time even though they can theoritically get around those two on their own if they were truly more popular.
A) the government had to step in and fix a lot of things that were broken due to rampant privatization and laissez fair economic policies
B) the government did a very good job of fixing said issues
The United States has already tried libertarianism. It did not go well. Apparently it takes about 100 years to forget these lessons.
[deleted] ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 20:52:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I can think of way smugger groups on the political landscape in 2017..
No I'm not a libertarian
[deleted] ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 20:35:27 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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10art1 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:25:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ew, the LP is literally the worst. Libertarians and the LP are natural enemies. Like commies and libertarians. Or fascists and libertarians. Or libertarians and libertarians. Damn libertarians! They ruined libertarianism!
theres an episode in season 3(?) where they say that being able to sue over sexual harassment in the work place/schools is fascism. It was always there, they just tended to use it as small jokes instead of the entire basis for the entire episode.
AGREED. Nowadays the writers are so caught up with the "ONE WEEK TO AIR" and everything has to be sooo fucking topical. Now it's like "how many issues du jour can we fit into one episode, then just have Randy yell absurd things really loudly over and over again for all the fanboys".
lava172 ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 21:56:48 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Even then it still was comedic back then, now the show just feels like a soapbox with a couple jokes thrown in
And it's pretty damaging and problematic in the long run. South Park is watched by a lot of people, and there is no doubt a lot of those said people end up taking this approach to a lot of social or political issues where if you attack both sides, you're actually the better person because you're free from the association of either side's worst people.
However, that kind of thinking is ultra dangerous and regressive because it creates complacency for problematic groups and people to waltz in with small resistance because of the subconsciously instilled idea that fighting against them makes you look as bad as the over exaggerated people in South Park.
I mean, hell, look at what happened in Charlottesville. There's a massive amount of people who aren't alt-right who are failing to see the problem with the fact that literal Nazis are walking through America because "well, the counter protesters are also being violent and weren't supposed to be there!" so that must mean that they're as bad as the people in the alt-right/white nationalist/nazi camp.
While it is far from being the blame for people thinking both sides should be equally condemned for what happened during the protests, it's a fair assessment that the show has helped normalize that kind of thinking as appropriate or the "best approach" for handling like-wise situations such at the one I gave as an example.
I get what you're saying but without any data to back it up, that's just your opinion.
People could even argue the opposite stance, that South Park gives the audience a look at two sides and leaves it up to you to decide what's best. You weigh your options and think critically.
I stand by what I said. Matt and Trey are not like this meme at all because they paint the whole picture, or as much as they can in 20 minutes, or an overarching story-line.
Some people can interpret it like you do or the complete opposite as you. That doesn't mean that the show shouldn't exist. Or that it's ruining your utopian society.
South Park makes fun of conservatives as much as liberals you stupid redneck, and I haven't seen anyone on either side getting mad at it, anyone who does is almost as stupid as you.
[deleted] ยท -38 points ยท Posted at 19:59:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Because you're an idiot that probably surrounds himself with bullshit that enforces your opinions and conveniently forget everything that goes against them
[deleted] ยท -9 points ยท Posted at 20:19:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Sablguy ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 20:27:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
his point is that reddit n most sites that u follow people or subscribe to stuff are echo chambers; since u only follow certain content, youll usually only get a certain opinion
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:30:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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Sablguy ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 20:30:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
mate i said usually, this sub doesnt generally have a certain political opinion, so here is one of the places youll find disagreement
I haven't seen anyone on Reddit recently get offended by South Park because almost everyone knows it's a joke, you have to seriously be looking to find that. If you've watched South Park at all you'd see it makes fun of shit like Jesus, gun-owners and Conservatives all the time. And yes, based on your username and a glance at your post history you're a dumb redneck.
gyroda ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:15:27 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Mate, people all over the political spectrum get upset about south park all the time.
And having criticisms of south park is not the same as getting upset by it, nor does getting upset by it automatically make your points invalid.
It's weird because Reddit would give Jon Stewart and other Daily Show alum a free pass because it's "just comedy" - even though they have the same reach and network as SP and are no less biased politically.
Like how fragile do you have to be to on a rant when a single voice out of dozens make political jokes that you don't agree with?
Yeah, they're called counter-signal memes, or "smuggies." I don't know if there's a subreddit for them or anything. Here's an album of some tho.
As others have noted below, this is an album of smuggies from /pol/, so a lot are pretty outrageous. But yes, there are a ton of these which is why you recognize the style.
Why should I be forced to act like I support a side I don't?
The logic against neutral or non-partisan stances can so easily be turned against itself "I always have to choose a side so I don't look weak, etc., etc."
I think it's more that, in our current political landscape, one of the sides has fucking nazis and yet there are still people who are saying "well hold on let's listen to both sides now". You don't have to be an extreme leftist, just, be willing to recognize and ideally act against an evil in the world.
And stop drowning everything in derailing rhetoric. Example: abortion. The right claims the left wants to kill babies, the left claims the right want control over women's decisions. Neither is the actual issue. What each side actually disagrees with is whether or not an embryo is a person. And since the concept of personhood is abstract and subjective, your stance is entirely based on opinion.
Zekeachu ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 06:07:22 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
the left claims the right want control over women's decisions
But... that one is true. The strongest and most common pro choice arguments don't really care about the personhood of the fetus, they care about bodily autonomy.
Pronounced dead when no heartbeat, pronounced alive when heartbeat?
lal0cur4 ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 01:00:29 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We don't even consider grown ass people with heart function human, people with no brain activity that are still "alive" have their organs harvested. Why hold fetuses to a different standard?
That's a false equivalence. You're talking about where we consider the beginning and ending of being a "human" and people that have gone through an awful life "ending" experience that leaves them braindead and unable to recover or live an even remotely normal life. They aren't the same.
I think a better example would be miscarriages. It's crushing and awful when they happen, but we don't mourn the loss in the same way as we do a death, because I think people inherently see a miscarriage as something somewhat different than a death. But what is that difference? Different people will tell you different things, because as I said; the concept of personhood is abstract and inherently subjective.
Also that's not a false equivalence. He didn't claim that taking someone off life support is the same as abortion, he's pointing out your suggested criteria for something to be a person (a beating heart) doesn't hold up when looking at a brain dead vegetable. If it doesn't apply there, it's not a good measure.
Aren't they people, though? If someone experiences a trauma and ends up being braindead, they're not instantly non-human and they do have a heartbeat. They are mentally gone, but their body is still functioning. However, I will concede that euthanasia is a mercy to them. Someone else pointed out miscarriages, and as far as that is concerned, that IS losing a life. The baby dies in the womb due to whatever complications. What I am asking is, if there are easily available contraception and preventative measures to having children (assuming the people in this thread I'm debating with live in the first world), why is abortion the issue? You can buy 100 condoms for 15 bucks or even a couple Plan B pills for 15 bucks, or if you have no money, swallow or spit. Seems like people trying to pass the buck for their own poor choices. Why kill unborn children?
Throw in rape or other extreme cases and it gets a little grayer and I'll admit I don't have a solution for that other than the rapist getting castrated or killed for potentially ruining two lives.
Well for one, contraceptives aren't 100% effective, and many people don't find out they did fail until it's far too late for the Plan B pill. Second, if abortion is okay in cases of rape or incest, how are you gonna regulate that? It seems unreasonable to wait for the police to catch and for the courts to decide that a person was raped. So if it's as simple as asking, someone who wasn't raped could just easily lie and say they were, and we're back to square one.
And to add; you keep implying that a fetus is a person like it's a fact when the root of the issue, as I've said, is that it's entirely opinion on whether or not it is.
For a lot of people it is more than an opinion. Also, I said I don't have the answer to the rape/other means of insemination so you basically asked "how are you going to regulate the thing that you said you don't have any idea how to regulate?". Additionally, part of the problem stems from both poor sex ed. in America, and another part is hook-up culture. You aren't going to be able to convince people that abortion is wrong if a great number of people willingly put themselves at risk of pregnancy. I'm not even religious but I recognize that people are hurting themselves in the long-term by ruining potential relationships with openness towards sexual promiscuity.
Dorocche ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:10:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Whether a personโs beliefs are valid doesnโt have an impact on what they are.
absolutely. it's the only reason why we can call centrism a belief system
lal0cur4 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:59:13 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"Centrism" is just propagation of the status quo. There's nothing moderate, peaceful, or wise about the status quo. All of the violence and coercion is just systematized and under wraps. What centrists are really afraid of is ruptures in the social order and the crystallization of that inherent violence in a visible and public way that gasp might slightly inconvenience them.
Also applies to people that say "my side is right!" With no further opinion or explanation. Add in a "if you can't see why, it's not worth explaining to you you" for good measure.
[deleted] ยท 41 points ยท Posted at 21:27:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mostly see "your side is wrong!" With name calling and no discussion.
[deleted] ยท 20 points ยท Posted at 01:15:20 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I deeply regret posting this. I thought it was funny and poked fun at people like me. It's not even about any specific issue but looking at the comments, somehow people have taken exception to this and are now very angry and have some very strong views about floating festival heads.
I apologise profusely. I will avoid posting stuff in future.
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 03:04:18 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The real me_irl is in the comments
Speaking as someone who is generally apolitical and likes to stay out of everything, I feel your pain. In the modern political environment of increasing polarization, moderates like you and neutrals like me are targets. Don't let the all the hate and fighting in this thread get you down, you seem like a nice person, and that's what really matters, not what side you take in a debate. I hope I've made you feel at least a little bit better.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:06:12 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I love it, because I hate radical centrists and it describes them perfectly.
dabmoms ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 12:29:20 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well when I wrote the text of this meme it was in regards to Charlottesville and the car attack and the whole punch a Nazi/ Antifa are terrorists arguments I was seeing online. So blame me for writing it I guess. I think thereโs benefits to staying in the middle but I also think that when white supremacists are swarming the streets you have to stand up and fight it or watch as they organize and grow and take power. They are rich, educated, young white men. They have too much power as it is.
_Serene_ ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:39:45 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No one cares tomorrow, don't be a sissy.
Ekat_clan ยท 106 points ยท Posted at 20:05:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Man this comment section is pure cringe jeez
[deleted] ยท 86 points ยท Posted at 21:19:46 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Pick a side to fight on or else you're the guy in the pic. Pretty ironic.
But โdonโt gas the jewsโ is way less far to the left than โgas the jewsโ is to the right, so the answer isnโt right in the center of those statements.
Zekeachu ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 06:10:40 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
...The answer is precisely "don't gas any Jews" tho. There's literally zero compromise or middle ground to be found. One is wrong and one is right.
thefran ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 06:37:20 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
but "don't gas any Jews" is not actually as leftist a view as possible.
CAB4yK ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 09:46:13 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'd say that opposite opinions would be "Jews are inferior" and "Jews are superior". It is not a political left-right dichotomy, because not everything has to be a left-right dichotomy.
comebepc ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 06:30:30 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If one side says gas the Jews, and the other side says shoot the bourgeoisie, we should compromise. Kill nobody.
FTFY
AATroop ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 22:01:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't see how this fits into this sub. This feels more like making fun of others than poking fun at ourselves. I guess I could be wrong though... shiiiit
UNSKIALz ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 20:08:05 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's me irl personally but agreed, probably coming from a pretty partisan place
Honestly I posted it here because I felt like it was aimed at people like me and I thought it was funny. I tend to float around the centre and this made me laugh at how I must seem to some people.
Yeah I can relate. Honestly I've kinda checked out these last few months. I hardly have the emotional capacity for it anymore. I respect those who are able to actually keep up with it anymore. I hate being apathetic, but I just don't know how to process it all (at least not in a way that doesn't just make me sad or angry).
Ever wanted to be morally superior to literally everyone no matter what the context? First, turn 16, then just take no position other than everyone else is always wrong.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 18:36:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
McDeely ยท 125 points ยท Posted at 18:54:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I hate the fact that this culture war has reached a point where even people who hold no extreme opinions and respect both sides of the argument are demonized. Right now it's a matter of "you agree with me or you are my enemy".
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. The comment I originally replied to was complaining about a culture war so that's what I was responding to.
thefran ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:35:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
idk, the ridiculous speed at which people are dropping the concept of "freedom of speech" as it is nothing but a tool of the oppressor will definitely qualify, for example.
You don't have to be a centrist to agree with the point though. There's more then left, right and center. You can even be a dedicated progressive, and simply not advocating violence to other people will get people replying to you with "R A D I C A L C E N T R I S M".
Todalooo ยท 45 points ยท Posted at 21:57:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Holy fucking shit you actually believe the "centrists think it's okay to half gas the jews" meme
That's not what I said. But when one side marches while using Nazi chants, it's kind of hard to believe anyone that doesn't outright reject that side isn't at least a little bit racist.
Well I guess it depends on what you mean by centrist, but since this thread started by making fun of people that say that the truth is always in the middle then that's the definition I'm going with. And if you think that the correct opinion is in between "Nazis are bad" and "Nazis aren't so bad" then you're pretty much supporting Nazis.
Ohh ok so pretty much the people you are making fun of don't exist, unless your definition of nazi is anyone right of center. Thanks for the clarification
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 23:53:51 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Damn, you actually believe that the majority of Republicans would go around yelling Nazi chants. I can't imagine being as delusional as you are.
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 01:33:13 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, because by saying "one side," you weren't referring to Republicans? The alternative is that you think that there's two sides, one being Democrats and the other, Nazis. Which is even more idiotic.
Not all Republicans, but any Republicans that support the current administration.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:10:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If you'd stop with the centrism, you'd recognise that both are on the same ideology.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:38:07 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
First of all, I'm not a centrist. Secondly, no they are not. If you really think that the majority of Republicans are pro-genocide, then you're a fucking moron.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:40:52 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm talking about democrats and republicans. And both are just as bad by tolerating nazi scum (ignoring the fact that they also both were responsible for genocides).
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:51:38 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You realize that the neo-nazis aren't taking up arms? They aren't lynching people, they aren't plotting to overthrow the government, and the ones that do are rightfully jailed. And what blurs the lines even more is that a lot of them nowadays don't actually endorse genocide, but creating a white ethnostate. Granted, that's an extremely shitty thing to think, but if they're just peacefully expressing support for that shitty thing, what are we supposed to do? I don't understand how you can believe in jailing people for having an opinion, or going further, killing them? I also don't want to jail or kill black supremacists for having the opinion they have, despite it being pretty horrendous.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 10:17:06 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't mean to be that guy, but that's an easy Google. A black supremacist is simply someone who believes that black people are a superior race to others, it's directly analogous to white supremacy. Although they obviously don't hold nearly the same amount of numbers as white supremacists, they're definitely out there. I've seen a lot of that shit on the internet, just people espousing really hateful views towards primarily white people (calling them animals and such). So my attitude towards them is similar to my attitude towards white supremacists. I don't like them or their views, but how could I possibly endorse punishment on them for simply thinking the things that they do?
Uuuuuuuh, no? Maybe it'd be something like "while one side is being racist and intolerant, maybe there are concerns regarding immigration policy that should be reviewed, we can't just let everyone in"
The other definition you were given is adequate, but I'll add that those "free speech warriors" who care more about your right to say something than whether you should.
I make decisions independently, but by and large, I agree with the left.
So I should never share ideas or join groups? No one should ever co-operate on anything for a common goal because they might disagree with them on a few minor points?
Sure, join a group. But don't blindly follow that group if they decide to do something. Educate yoyrself on the issue and try to make up your own mind. If you agree, great. I tend to lean towards a lot of what the left think. But also don't trust that the politicians. They are only interested in their careers like the rest.
The fuck are you on about? The problem was not enough people had health care, the solution was more people having healthcare. It's really very simple and anyone with some level of intelligence could work that out.
Oooooh now I see why you're a centerist.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 20:37:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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Valoid ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:40:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
C'mon this is reddit you have to be something, and if you aren't, we'll choose for you. Tough luck if you don't like it. /s
alaricus ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:48:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You see many children working in factories?
Gordo778 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:36:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"Both side are right, but both sides murder. I give up, so why can't they?"
-X (The band, not the Malcom)
Gordo778 ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 22:38:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I hate that people are so unwilling/uninformed that they refuse to have opinions. Not only that, but they use their lack of knowledge to adopt a holier-than-thou attitude like theyโre winning/avoiding some disasterous โculture war.โ
If you understood most political issues today, youโd have opinions on them.
McDeely ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 22:57:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Being moderate, or in the middle, centrist, whatever you want to call it isn't about not having opinions, it's about sympathising with all different sides in order to form more balanced opinions. I agree with the right on some stuff, the left on others.
I think there are people out there who sort of have their opinions decided for them because they just go with whatever their side believes in.
I have strong opinions about most things, but you won't find that they all line up entirely with the left or the right. I might be left on one issue but then right on another. So what then? If the word centrist leaves a bad taste in your mouth then by all means try to pigeon-hole me into whatever label you see fit, but I think you'd have a hard time.
It's like how a lot of the alt-right groups (Proud Boys for example) started believing in things like Christianity just because that's what the right does. They are generally from a demographic that is likely to be apathetic about religion and now they are full-on church-going Christians just because their parent party believes in it. That kind of ideological osmosis can't be a good thing.
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 00:38:26 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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Gordo778 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 03:22:32 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
critisized strawmen
uses a strawman
Apparently by having an opinion Iโm โone dimensionalโ or โNot acknowledging the complexity of issues.โ Either you recognize that white supremecy is bad, or you support white supremecy. Either you denounce the presidentโs blatant lying, or youโre complacent in it. You donโt have to pledge allegience to a party, but there are quite a few political issues where a middle ground approach makes no sense. Thereโs an epidemic of lazy ambivolence and psuedo intellectual equivelence masquerading as intelligent centrism, which is exactly what the OP is mocking.
[deleted] ยท 33 points ยท Posted at 20:03:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Iโm unironically a centrist and donโt see anything wrong with it. Most of the only arguments against it are โitโs weakโ and โIโm afraid to take a sideโ as if Iโm just copping out by not being too far left, right, up, or down
Gordo778 ยท 22 points ยท Posted at 22:40:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It depends what you mean by centrist.
Do you not agree with all aspects of a political ideology? Cool.
Did you actually not vote in this election because โle both sides are the same?โ
Then youโre a moron.
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 23:27:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I have political views from both sides that draw me to the center. I believe in change when needed and conservation when reasonable.
Zekeachu ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 06:13:03 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Not to be too much of a personal attack but that's so vague it's entirely a useless statement.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:53:17 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Canโt be bothered to elaborate, I donโt have shit to prove
gyroda ยท 28 points ยท Posted at 22:27:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There's nothing wrong with being centrist politically, we all fall somewhere after all.
There are two issues though. One is what OP is mentioning, those who refuse to say anything constructive and just shit on everything else.
The other is what the root comment is talking about, the idea that the solution is always in the middle and that compromise is always good. You might argue that the with the extreme right and extreme left you might find decent proposals in the middle, but that's a wide ground you can call "in the middle". The other issue is that often it's "extreme ______ wing" arguing with someone not "extreme", so the middle of those two is pretty fucking skewed. Finally you get the people who you shouldn't compromise with at all, so you wouldn't say "hey so we agree the climate is changing but not the cause? Compromise!" because climate change denialism isn't a strong argument.
Well you went to the trouble of listing specific arguments and implied that the list was mostly complete. I think what I posted is a large category of arguments you either ignored or hadn't heard.
Since your reply basically just repeated my comment, I'm going with "ignored"
[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 00:03:46 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You posted one argument, which was putting words in my mouth.
The arguments in my original comment were arguments Iโve heard from people about being moderate/centrist.
I donโt understand what your criticism of my comment is to be honest.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:35:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Come join us on the South East. We believe in pancakes on election day. Or else.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 19:25:59 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 20:04:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Hehe my political compass was literally a notch to the left from the direct center
[deleted] ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 20:08:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:21:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
:(
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 20:37:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:49:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Excellent image. To intelligent too not be absolute center
I don't think you know what moderate means. Also do you mean contempt or content?
bwana22 ยท -5 points ยท Posted at 20:55:33 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Go on then, tell me what moderate means
McDeely ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 21:13:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Moderate: Here's my opinion, and I respect your opinion even though I disagree with it. Also I'm willing to change my opinion based on new facts that come to light instead of having an emotional attachment to my side of the argument. I hope my views inform your beliefs and we can come to a compromise and a better understanding of one another.
Shithead: I'm objectively correct and your opinion should be shut down because I don't like it.
bwana22 ยท -5 points ยท Posted at 21:19:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
So are you willing to change anything with your views or are you just going to tell people what you think and if they don't like it you just shrug your shoulders even if they are gassing people, lynching people, or have serious intent to?
You have it wrong. The shithead lynching and gassing people is calling the person not supporting him cowardly and moderate because they don't share the same extremist views.
bwana22 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:31:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Not everyone who opposes Nazis is a Nazi... if that's what you're trying to say...
No the shithead in my example was gassing people he thought were Nazis. Killed a few innocents, but all in the name of not being a cowardly moderate.
bwana22 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:43:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Usually Nazis who are the ones with serious intent to lynch and gas people
E: lol the ninja edit
...
What?
Are you trying to imply anti Nazis are gassing Nazis?
McDeely ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:33:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Of course I'd be willing to change and evolve my views, I've been doing it my whole life. I didn't just develop a set of opinions when I turned 16 and stuck with them.
As for your hypothetical, there's nothing I can personally do about the extremists. I'll happily have a discussion with a Muslim but I'm not going to go out and become a vigilante counter-terrorist to deal with the lynching and "serious intent".
bwana22 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:37:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But moderate views don't move from the general political sphere. No pushing boundaries. I don't have set views either. I have set principles as anyone does but my views still change.
there's nothing I can personally do about the extremists.
There's lots you can do personally about extremists. Maybe get up and protest? Stand up for yourself and others?
I respect your opinion even though I disagree with it
And when this opinion is "kick out the dirty non-whites?" Do you respect that opinion?
McDeely ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 22:16:50 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No but I respect their right to have that opinion. I respect that morality isn't absolute and that they have a different worldview than myself i.e. it isn't immoral in their mind.
I don't agree with "let's throw the gays off the roof", or "stone rape victims", but I still respect the rights of the belief system that informs those opinions.
not at all. a tolerant society will see intolerant views and argue with them in a calm manner, point out the flaws in those views, and shut them down through that way instead of through censorship or some other bullshit.
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 21:26:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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bwana22 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:29:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Did I say that? Centrists take from all parties and ideologies.
[deleted] ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 21:06:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If you honestly believe that there are only two possible ideologies to hold strong to in the world, then you should think twice before criticizing anyone about politics and society. I had to re-group after realizing your comment wasn't satirical in nature. I'm not trying to be offensive, it just shows a serious inability to comprehend how complicated this subject is.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:19:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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bwana22 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:23:35 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Political ideology is not a fixed left or right. The spectrum doesn't exist.
The issue with moderates is that they don't feel passionate about anything. They're willing to watch power be taken from them, purely because "people are entitled to their opinion". They're willing to let the shittiest people rule over them out of blind principle.
Moderates never overthrew feudalism, moderates never overthrew slavery, moderates never defeated the nazis.
jodius ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:46:10 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
People don't hate centrists because they're centrists, they hate centrists because they're not on their side. When was the last time you said "that person is everything I disagree with, but at least they picked a side"
[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 02:01:44 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There are people with consistent moderate viewpoints, and then there's the people this post is making fun of, "centrists" who think taking a neutral stance on everything makes them more intelligent and rational or whatever, but who never actually bother to put any thought or study into their reasoning. I'd say it's making fun of lazy thinking more than anything.
Pyrux ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 22:13:33 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sorry I donโt like being lumped in with the racist extremists on one side, and the racist extremists on the other. The rational non-extremist people seem to be dwindling.
None of us know what weโre doing, donโt be so full of yourself. Weโre all idiots
bewk ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 05:41:27 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 05:15:30 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
When you watch Rick and Morty.
FTFY.
Zhensta ยท 87 points ยท Posted at 17:50:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
โThey have a right to advocate for racial cleansing! You canโt just shut out opinions that disagree with your own!โ
To make myself clear. I am opposed to the idea that freedom of speech some how exempts you from any criticism and is shouted as if it is the solve all rebuttal. Freedom of speech is a two way street if you open your opinion up to a public forum that forum reacts with criticism both entities are well within their rights. Rights that i both agree with and support
The point im trying to make is you canโt say โbut freedom of speechโ at any criticism to make it go away because that criticism is just that, freedom of speech.
Example: your opinion sucks so im going to ostracize you and condemn your actions. You will in return condemn my opinion or make an opinion about me. Its all protected.
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 21:42:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You have the right to say what you want. You have the right to call the people who have those culturally destructive people an asshole.
They dont just believe dumb shit, they believe in the extermination of millions of people. Its not like people are using violence against a peaceful movement. They are using violence against an evil violent movement. I don't really agree completely with punching nazis but don't frame it like they are just people with different ideas. Some ideas do need shut down and not given a stage.
Gravnor ยท 63 points ยท Posted at 19:58:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Shutting down ideas through violence doesn't do anything but set a precedent that it's perfectly acceptable to do the same to any ideas.
The fact that an idea of genocide is being promoted openly already means that the violence barrier has already been crossed. Violence is more than throwing punches.
Gravnor ยท 25 points ยท Posted at 22:34:45 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
My point still stands.
comebepc ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:31:48 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It has always been an acceptable part of the political toolbox. Pacifism has never been the platform of successful ideologies.
Infidel6 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 00:22:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Pacifism is what has allowed us to thrive long enough to be able to advance to a point where people can use a world wide web to express their desire to fight in the streets like a bunch of fucking barbarians.
You really need to be more specific because as far as I can tell we've been at war more or less constantly for a while now.
Infidel6 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 01:51:39 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm not talking about the geopolitical meddling of the US government. Im talking about a society that can exist because people aren't splintering off into tribes and attacking one another.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 07:05:38 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mean when you think about it we're just in the winning tribe in this situation
Kinda shifting the goal posts aren't you? We were talking about pacifism. I brought up war, and now you're saying "oh but that's not civil war." As if that was the point.
But ok let's go down your logical path and talk about violence within our borders. When has our society ever existed without violence or the threat of it? Has there ever been no police? Has there ever been no political repression? Maybe you think some of that violence is justified, maybe even desirable, but it's still violence. All societies are built on an element of that. Just because we're not slaughtering each other in the streets doesn't mean there isn't a great deal of violence going on.
Infidel6 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 02:35:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No. You tried to derail it into war, which has nothing to do with you personally justifying the battery of another person.
If violence exists and you see it as a bad thing, then why would you choose to support more violence? Furthermore, do you seriously believe that people fear arrest because all police are violent? I'm pretty sure people are more deterred from violence by the idea of spending a significant amount of time in prison.
It has always been an acceptable part of the political toolbox. Pacifism has never been the platform of successful ideologies.
My first comment. Nothing said about whether I personally think it's justified to punch people. I'm putting into context that political violence is neither new nor unique to any one point on the political spectrum. War is political violence. That violence has consistently been used to target specific political tendencies. We do not live in a pacifist society.
You don't think putting people in prison is violent? What happens if I resist arrest? What happens if I try to leave prison? The threat of violence is the foundation of the rule of law. Again, maybe you think that's fine. I personally have complex and sometimes conflicting feelings about it. That's another discussion though.
Civilization is built on violence. Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it any less true.
jodius ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:58:30 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes and no. Gandhi's movement was of peaceful resistance but there was a century of violence leading up to that point. We like to whitewash that part of history but it's entirely possible Gandhi would've failed completely if there hadn't been so much violence preceding his movement. Even during his era of peaceful protests there were many instances of violent resistance.
Every idea gets a stage and gets to get criticized, the strong ones will withstand criticism and the bad ones (any movement that includes genocide will fall into this category) will crumble. You just have to believe that Nazi/White Supremacist ideas are so poor that they will crumble and most will see their flaws.
When they stop talking and start acting, i'll be right there with you ready to punch some people, but till then i'm gonna meme them till the world realizes what a joke they are.
And I know I have a way too optimistic worldview looking at the world in the binary of "not Nazis" and "people who have yet to be convinced of Nazism failings", but what I believe is that there will never be enough people in the "people who have yet to be convinced of Nazism failings" camp to even make a difference.
Edit: Also an addition, like every identitarian movement, they think of themselves as victims and when people punch them its them being oppressed even more (a lot of them think that they're so oppressed that the public won't even let them talk about their oppression). With every nazi you punch, you probably radicalize 5 more.
Except they are people with different ideas. You should not commit violence against anyone who holds any belief until that holder becomes violent themselves. Then you can take measures of violence to defend yourself or someone else. But until it reach that point, being violent only makes you as bad as you say they are.
Let's flip the tables. You say "we should punch Nazis because they advocate for violence against people". What, then, is stopping Nazis from using the same logic and saying "we should punch <people who want to punch nazis> because they advocate for violence against us".
And to clarify, speech is not and can not be violent unless it is used in a manner that physically harms a person. Saying "we should kill 6 million Jews" is a radically different act than actually doing it. Personally, only an idiot would believe that the two are equal enough to warrant the same punishment.
Zhensta ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 18:45:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Because being a nazi inherently means you are the one originally provoking the initiation of violence? Being a poc or a jew doesnโt warrant violence upon yourself...
If being a Nazi means you are the one provoking the violence, then by your definition, the right wing protestors at Charlottesville were victims of the far left anti fascist Nazis, as it was the far left that initiated the violence.
Obviously this is not the case. Being a Nazi is not simply "initiating violence". It is a set of ideas and principles that, clearly, are regressive and unethical.
Being a poc or a jew doesnโt warrant violence upon yourself...
I never said it did. And I agree it does not. Just like simply "believe" something does not. If a person "believes" the earth is flat, he is clearly an idiot, and some attempt should be made to inform him as to why and how the earth is round. However, you should not be allowed to ban him from speaking just because he is an idiot.
This logic applies to the "punch a Nazi" debate. If a person believes that "Jews should be exterminated", then you still have no grounds for stopping him from speaking. You can try to pursuance that person to view what you believe to be true, and if he doesn't listen, then just ignore him. But if he tries to implement harm in any capacity, you now have grounds to use violence to defend yourself.
Zhensta ยท -9 points ยท Posted at 19:30:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well the point of the rally in Charlottesville is to see the policy implemented, but i guess thats not your definition of an attemped implementation. Also โantifa nazisโ do you know what antifa is short for? Yes people say they are antifa just to cause violence at protests. Yes people use the guise of movements to hide ill intentions, but by literal fucking definition an antifa (words definition short for antifascist) nazi is an oxymoron. Words dont change definition because of your personal feelings or your own biases towards them. Also there is a big fucking difference between racial cleansing and saying the earth is flat...
[deleted] ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 19:47:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Don't you realize that the first thing these people would do if they were in power is take away freedom of speech? The only reason they constantly bring it up is because they know fucking classic liberals have such a giant free speech boner they will let them get away with being, you know, literal Nazis. And clearly it's working.
Edit: also, antifa literally only exists as a reaction to nazis and fascists. If their hateful garbage wasn't allowed to spread so far that they hold marches shouting 'the Jews will not replace us', antifa wouldn't have a reason to exist. Nazis go away, antifa goes away.
Zhensta ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 19:50:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yo what a fucking logical as fuck argument, thanks!
Why even participate in the discussion if thats all you have to add? You could just downvote me and move on.
It's been explained to you in a perfectly understandable manner. Rather than actually read the argument, you pick out one thing about antifa and prove yourself to be a fucking moron.
Zhensta ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:06:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I called out multiple things and again that doesnโt explain why commenting insults is productive, but yea okay dude thanks
Insulting someone isn't productive? Well neither is punching people.
By using violence against these people you only reinforce their shitty fucking beliefs.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:11:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The irony in literally side stepping what i called you out for. And AGAIN i do not care about the well being of people with the agenda that i should be euthanized because of the way i was born. If they get punched in the face I donโt care thats all i have said on the issue
I don't care about the feelings of a moron who can't possibly conceive that s/he could be wrong. I will continue to insult this fucking jackass for being a brain dead scum fuck hypocrite. If this person's feelings get hurt I don't care that's all I've said on the issue.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:16:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I asked how itโs productive to the argument? Not about my feelings? And you are the one fucking tilted for no reason. You are literally telling me im an idot for not caring about the safety of nazis who advocate commit and attempt to institute state sponsored violence yet tell me im wrong for supposedly advocating to punch them? It literally make no fucking sense
How is it productive in reforming awful beliefs if we just go around punching people instead of talking to them about it?
Do you really not see the parallel I'm drawing here? Are you illiterate? Maybe we should punch you until you can read.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:32:18 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
To be fair have you ever spent this much time actually trying to convince a nazi not to commit racial genocide? Or is the idea of people telling them โno we will fight backโ against that idea the only time you become an advocate for the first amendment?
Otherwise yea i agree with you peace should be and always has to be the formost pursuit, but again what i am saying is I DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE WELL BEING OF PEOPLE WHO INITIALLY WENT TO SEEK VIOLENCE AND FOUND IT. Convince them otherwise? sure seek peace? of course. Have i ever punched a Nazi? No. Will i punch a nazi? Probably not. My point is the people who literally want to see me in a slave labor camp or dead are not and will not be a concern for me.
I feel like I'm trying to convince one right now. Do you not see the irony in what you're preaching at all?
Daryl Davis is a black blues musician who has directly reformed multiple high profile white supremacist/nazis. Just by talking to them, by using kindness and peace. It's okay to be uncomfortable by nazis, it's okay to hate what they believe. But it's not okay to use violence against anyone. It doesn't work. Psychology, history, Daryl Davis, MLK, all continuously prove that violence is not the fucking answer.
Zhensta ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:49:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
To be fair MLK was Assassinated but you are right his advocacy for peace and his success canโt be ignored. With that said i want you to understand i am not advocating for violence. I am just saying i have a right to not care or feel bad when a group that advocates genocide voluntarily participates in violence and then has violence committed onto them. It is not and shouldnโt be my responsibility to reform grown adults struggling to understand that the world is changing. Unchecked though these entities have proven themselves to succeed. I mean we fought a world war over this.
No, these entities have proven themselves to failure. We won the war against them, and they haven't risen to power since.
I'm not telling you to feel bad for nazis, I'm telling you to seek reform in the way of peace. You don't punch nazis to stop them from taking power-- that will literally only make them stronger in their resolve. You vote to keep them out of office.
Zhensta ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:06:38 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Vote to keep them out of office... i mean come on... anyway i digress. It doesnโt validate your point that the war wasnt won through peacefull reform. The means that were used to bring about its end were the only means by witch is was achieved seeing as it still took a decade to achieve including the 4+ years America was actually involved. But AGAIN i see what you are saying and we agree with each other or at least i think we do ie โim not telling you to feel bad for nazisโ
Zinogrey ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:15:58 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Youโre fucking thick, dude.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:17:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ah shit the logic wizards are really coming out of the wood work
Zinogrey ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:58:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You canโt even comprehend my logic, I watch rick and morty.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:59:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Fuuuuuuuck. The pickle rick joke went straight over my head .Have mercy
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:17:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Graffy ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:23:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm not saying punching people should be legal even if they are Nazis. But I definitely don't feel sympathy for any Nazis getting punched. We fought a war against them they have any more business being accepted than Isis does.
I can understand not feeling sympathy for them. It's a bit heartless, but I can see where you're coming from. I say that because I don't feel sympathy when their arguments are defeated.
However, I take contention with
We fought a war against them they have any more business being accepted than Isis does.
It depends on what you mean by accepted. If you mean "should be allowed to speak", then there is a difference. A (presumably non-american) ISIS member is not protected under the constitution and therefore does not have their freedom of speech protected by America. If they come to America and preach their radical ideology, I believe that they should be shut down and sent back. If a Nazi comes from Germany, the same thing should happen.
But if the two are American citizens, then I accept their right to speak. I don't like what they have to say, but I will defend to the death their right to say it. If you can rationalize silencing one ideology because you don't like it, then anyone can rationalize any ideology that they don't like.
We should wait until they try. Until then, use your nonviolent means to prevent them from getting into a position where that is a possibility. We live in a democracy. You have a vote.
Graffy ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:33:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You don't think there's groups of Nazis committing hate crimes?
I'd like to see these "hate crimes" by confirmed Nazis. It seems like very time there is a cry of "Nazi hate crime", this is a retraction a few days later about how the offender was a member of the community he intended to strike against.
But I'm genuinely interested. If you could point me in the direction of a few Nazi hate crimes, i would appreciate it.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 07:17:28 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The Charleston shooting and the whole Charlottesville ramming thing are pretty good examples off the top of my head.
The "Charlottesville Ramming" occurred during a brawl initiated by the left winged counter protestors. Yes, of course, it is awful that someone died as a result, but you must understand that using it as an example of right winged violence is like giving a baby an open carton of milk and being yelling at the baby when he spills it. The baby wrong for spilling milk, but maybe you should not have given it to him.
The Charleston shooting was a tragedy, and a very good example for you to use. But I now present the example of James Hodgkinson. Far left, card holding democrat. Attempted murder against Steve Scalise and other republican congressmen.
If 1 act of violence on part of a community's member is enough to silence the community, and take actions to violently shut down the community, then both the Nazis and the far left can both be shut down by these examples.
But I disagree with this on a point of principle. They are allowed to talk for the same reason that I support any other group's right to talk. Allow me to demonstrate this principle, where it's limit lies, and why it is necessary in a free society.
I think we can both agree that ISIS is bad. That's a fairly non-controversial statement, right? Well just like the two aforementioned groups, I support their right to speak. If an American citizen is a part of the group and has not yet committed any crime, then I will defend their right to speak the ideas, principles, and goals of ISIS. They are even allowed to try and recruit. However, I believe the limit lies here; if a person attempts to leave the country for the purpose of joining Isis, then he can be restricted. Furthermore, if the original speaker commits a crime related to what he is preaching, then that individual has shown that he is a violent individual and therefore can be restricted.
This principle is necessary simply because it protects the people who speak under it. The moment you claim "this group should not speak because individuals did violence", then you can justify any group speaking using the same logic.
Let's pretend that by some miracle, the Nazis make a come back and are the dominant force in America. Using the logic of "Nazis are violent, silence them", they can now say "The left wanted to punch and silence us, silence them." They have used your same logic and have not lied in this example, but I think we can both agree they are wrong.
If the principle of free speech for all is upheld, everyone benefits. If it is not, then everyone looses eventually. Just because you are not the one loosing right now does not mean that won't change.
A democracy that is regularly abused and corrupted to the point that someone in the middle of a field can have a more important and valuable vote than someone living in a city, where things like Texas' 35th district exist.
If someone points a loaded gun at me I'm not going to wait for them to shoot me before I try to fight back.
A democracy that is regularly abused and corrupted to the point that someone in the middle of a field can have a more important and valuable vote than someone living in a city, where things like Texas' 35th district exist.
And despite nearly 250 years, we haven't dissolved into an oppressive dictatorship. Amazing.
If someone points a loaded gun at me I'm not going to wait for them to shoot me before I try to fight back.
And if someone says "I'm going to initiate a genocide against your entire race", the danger is a whole lot less probable. Notice the distinction here?
Now, if someone says "I'm currently geocoding your entire race" and then pulls a gun in you, the danger suddenly becomes a whole lot more probable again. Do you see the distinction yet?
And despite nearly 250 years, we haven't dissolved into an oppressive dictatorship. Amazing.
And as we all know, all republics are eternal and never become dictatorships. We should just ignore the fascists who want to ethnically cleanse America; when have they ever overthrown a government?
Ideas absolutely can be violent. I'm not gonna buy into the slippery slope argument you are pushing, you can use slippery slope to argue literally anything. You need to look at how the nazis originally gathered a following and attained power. If nazis never were allowed to speak and be seen as just another opinion WW2 wouldn't have happened.
Ok ok, but how to we decide as a collective nation of individuals what ideas deserve to be snuffed out at the moment of conception? Is this possible? Can we as a unit more or less decide "yes, these ideas are bad, and they should be eradicated, and people who hold these ideas should be convinced their ideas are wrong and they should be detained until this is accomplished".
I don't know if I feel comfortable with punishing people with thoughtcrimes but at the same time I understand that there ARE dangerous ideas out there that I would prefer would not exist.
Buzz_Fed ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:33:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well I think we can definitely start by saying that advocating genocide is not a legitimate opinion.
Graffy ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:32:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Let's start with "any group that wants to deny the rights of others based on color or gender" and just leave it at that. We're not saying you can't have those thoughts. But you shouldn't be able to organize a public rally in the streets.
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 20:11:05 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
This is where I have to agree with you humble kendrick fan. I think for bad or worse as long as they literally arenโt screaming about imminently committing crimes then it would be wrong to deny them a stage. If you deny anyone a stage it opens up the possibility of any stage being denied, then you just have a state where opinions are controlled
Make America Hate Nazis Again. It's a movement I could get behind. Appeasing those with Nazi views and giving them a safe platform to spew their toxicity ended up with millions dead. Fuck no, their call to violence bullshit isn't allowed here. Punch Nazis.
No itโs only okay for people with beliefs similar to theirs to do that. Fuck nazis but they have the same right to assembly and free speech as every other American. As soon as they start advocating for actual violence thatโs considered hate speech and their asses are getting shut down.
I think your words are a call for violence (you are literally calling for violence lul) and toxic, am I justfied in sucker punching you right in the stomach? Or am I missing something?
Taeyyy ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 21:22:07 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
To be fair, there is a difference between calling for genocide and calling for punching people.
Nobody was advocating for this, at least not until the term Nazi started being thrown around.
Yeah, the term Nazi just started being thrown randomly. No reason for it. Had nothing to do with people marching through the street with Nazi flags.
mattpiv ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 21:17:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We're all adults here, we should all be able to see that a non-violent solution is 100% times more preferable than violence. But there are some very few times where violence is the only solution. We tried non-violence with the Nazis before and it only allowed them to get stronger and enabled their genocide. The only way to stop the spread of that hateful and destructive ideology is to resist it at every corner in any way possible. If that means knocking a few motherfuckers out, than so be it.
I mostly agree. I feel like you need a good balance between shutting down nazis and not giving them any type of platform and also not giving them ammo to cry out and act as victims. The very sad truth is that there are a lot of people in this country who will see a nazi get punched and feel sorry for them. Leading to them in some way sympathizing them. I don't really know what needs to be done but i do know letting them give speeches isn't going to help anything, history proves that.
They choose that view. They aren't born Nazis, no one is stopping them from not being the scum of the earth. They choose that. Anyone who sympathizes with people who call for genocide has some serious issues of their own. If a nazi feels like a victim, good. They don't get to feel safe and cozy in their racist little world. They deserve a whole lot more than a punch to the face, but they all at the very least deserve that. Fuck. Nazis. Gently, with a chainsaw.
I'm cool with all of that for a lot of views. But claiming the name Nazi for yourself is where I draw the fucking line. Not here. Not anywhere. Never again.
God I hope you're joking. This has been shown so many times it's not even fucking funny. People with intense racist/nazi beliefs can and have been reformed countless times.
Daryl Davis is living proof that kindness and calm conversation and debate reforms racism and nazi beliefs.
Edit: and what do you mean by "other views"?
Thybro ยท -4 points ยท Posted at 20:44:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes that works on the small scale in the mean time the others are out there spreading intolerance getting followers at twice the rate you can convince some to turn away from it. You canโt tolerate flat intolerance because eventually intolerance reigns.
I donโt see why there canโt be a two prong approach you reach out to those open to it while you snuff out those who wonโt stop spreading that racist bullshit.
Look I understand people being worried that a slippery slope that weโll turn into a PC culture where everyone gets punched for being โoffensiveโ but most people arenโt advocating that they are advocating punching literal Nazis with Nazi ideas and Nazi methods.
If they are in a clearly defined assembly and there is no question in what the specific person you were to punch stands for (white supremacy, Nazi), I won't get too bent out of shape and I don't think many people will. But the second any "anti Nazi" or "anti fascist" groups start making assumptions of their own and assaulting innocent civilians en masse, at will...the police are going to stop fucking around and I'll support them. so will the local community.
Zaramoth ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:03:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The people replying to you dont seem to understand that Fascists accredit freedom of speech and a platform to spread their hate to their rise. Nazi's take their beliefs and dilute it until its just being "anti-immigration" and "taking the country back to its roots" or explaining that minorities arent a part of the national "soul" Which gains them traction with the regular middle class enough to do shit like take over Germany and exterminate 11 million innocent people.
They also dont get that, of the couple of nazis who have been punched in the face on TV and interviewed after, they are afraid to talk out about their beliefs again. Which means the violence worked
Yeah but there are plenty of extreme people out there going sound with this punch a Nazi shit who just think that anyone who leans right is a nazi. In fact that's most of them
Ehhhh, no. I think once one side engages in violence because they donโt like what another side is saying, then that actually legitimizes the other sidesโ case and may cause them to act violently. Thatโs what happened with the alt-right, itโll probably happen again.
White supremacist groups have the right to say what they want, they just donโt have to be listened to and can be mocked. Institutions should not shut down free speech. The general public should be given the responsibility to decide which ideas are popular based on their own judgement. No speech should shut down.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:08:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's not your job. It's not your decision. You cannot put your hands on me regardless of what comes out of my mouth. You can refuse to patronize me in any way, you can make the public aware that I hold these views so they don't patronize me, you can counter protest my views peacefully or even push the government to intervene. But you CAN NOT physically harm another American solely because you disagree with them. Fuck that.
Zhensta ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 18:30:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Im all for somebody having every right to disagree with me on how to spend tax dollars to better stimulate the economy, but if your entire agenda is to see the extermination of entire populations of people... I simply do not care about your well being seeing as your agenda revolves around violence to begin with. I know that is an unpopular opinion and this will be downvoted but I canโt rationalize the safety and well being of a group of grown adults who want to literally kill entire populations of people based on their own emotional insecurity.
Side note the use of โyourโ in my explanation is being used non personally.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 19:53:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What? Do you realize how dumb that comparison is? A) the means of production is not a group of people, and b) taking back the means of production doesn't have to be violent.
But we all know the end goal of nazism. Genocide of anyone who disagrees. Why even let it begin to take root if it will either die off on its own or be forcibly destroyed once it actually starts genociding?
Would rather live in a world where there are no nazis because everyone has heard of their ideas and the ideas countering nazism and all decided that Nazism is a stupid ideology, or a world where there are no (openly) nazis because everyone was too scared of big brother beating them down.
Its the same end result, no nazis, and one will get you there quicker (censorship) but only one really solves the problem and will create a better community IMO.
And I know its a utopian Idea that will probably never be achieved, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try does it?
But if everyone were reasonable enough to look at nazism and the counters to nazism and realize nazism is bad, why are there still nazis? And this isn't Big Brother imposing his will, it's common people like you and me protecting our freedoms. Nazism and freedom cannot coexist.
probably in echo chambers. and yea some people may not be convinced, I'm sure there are people who will not change their mind, but what matters is that they will never gain a relevant amount of support.
Their always gonna be those 500 dudes that the rest of the country just hates with a passion.
And this isn't Big Brother imposing his will, it's common people like you and me protecting our freedoms. Nazism and freedom cannot coexist.
I guess its kinda dark but, wouldn't real freedom include the freedom to be a nazi?
I mean I guess here you kinda hit the tolerance paradox, which at least right now my answer is, say anything but as soon as you do a bad action you can no longer be tolerated.
Oh and social ostracization, people should be socially encouraged to not hold shitty beliefs.
Not where are there still nazis, why are there still nazis? The whole point that there are actual nazis right refutes you entire assumption that human beings are perfectly rational beings who, with just enough/the right information, would obviously see that nazism is bad. That's just not how human beings work.
Garinn ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:13:10 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Nobody has ever asserted that humans are perfectly rational beings.
TNine227 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:08:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If someone flies a swastika flag, I'm gonna call them a nazi.
TNine227 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:31:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mean there just aren't that many Nazis in the US. Yeah, you can see relatively big groups of them but that's just because the US is big--the portion of the country that is actual Nazis is a statistical footnote.
You actually won't get arrested for advocating the overthrow of the government, people call for it every day.
You can be arrested if there is a plan in place to do so, just like a nazi would be arrested if they had a plan in place to kill non-whites. Like I've said in other comments, speak all the dumb shit you want but as soon as you act the government will/should step in (and citizens if law enforcement isn't present).
Thanks for the correction! I actually agree with you guys now. Until we can prove they will take action against people, we cannot prosecute/ punish them.
And i definitely see your point about defending and i could understand your worry about them doing so, but if it helps quell your fears there's so many fucking FBI agents in far right groups its insane.
Super common joke among those people to even to the point where they accuse some of the thought leaders in their movements of being FBI plants.
Well that kind of quells my fears, but they were in Leftist groups during the civil rights movements too. They infiltrate any group that criticizes them. And thatโs scary lol
I would assume that they infiltrate any group that has a potential to turn violent.
I guess during the civil rights times they wanted to make sure that the protesting remained relatively peaceful and that there were no planned attacks that could lead to a large body count luckily there was none of that (had there been I bet the civil rights movement would not have been successful because even if it was the right thing, public perception of your movement will matter a lot more than whether or not you're right).
Haha dude, the civil rights movement was violent as fuck. Sometimes THANKS to the fbi. They instigated many violent interactions with the police to ruin public perception. Not the opposite. Iโm on mobile so I canโt link any thing, but youโve got it backwards my dude.
Wait what? WHAT? Two people with opposing opinions actually came to a conclusion? Someone had their opinion changed??? On Reddit!???!?! What the hell is going on!
[deleted] ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 17:56:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Zhensta ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 18:04:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No. I am opposed to the idea that freedom of speech some how exempts you from any criticism and is shouted as if it is the solve all rebuttal. Freedom of speech is a two way street if you open your opinion up to a public forum that forum reacts with criticism both entities are well within their rights. Rights that i both agree with and support
The point im trying to make is you canโt say โbut freedom of speechโ at any criticism to make it go away because that criticism is just that, freedom of speech. Sorry for the long reply
Thankfully I can usually back it up, it works pretty well, the one group were a bunch of racial collectivists that liked white people so much that they hated other races, the other side were a bunch of social collectivists that believe that the opinions they disagree with should be silenced violently,including completely reasonable ones. Both sides are idiots.
wouldnโt this picture be wrong? If you can float due to your expanded head, then you gotta have air or something lighter in it. This would have to mean that he is either heating up air in an empty brain cavity or has helium in it. The correct picture would be of someone drilling to the center of the earth with the weight of your brain or some representation of the weight of the brain mass.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 22:03:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
ur prolly that guy who everyone simply says he's not worth explaining to. if it's not going to change ur stance, why go into the likely long explanation you require beyond the obvious?
Even if you did change, ur one person which changes nothing of the bigger issue being discussed, so why bother? More fun to watch your brain implode over the lack of thought, easier to let you go on ur own tangent.
If you managed to at show at least 1 person your point it's better than just say "both sides suck" and leave everyone confused about your general opinion, at that point you are literally wasting yours and everyone's time and it would be the equivalent to just say nothing.
Yes, A and B are both failing on horrible ways, but if A or B have done any other thing that benefits you, your general opinion should be.
"I highly disagree with A/B on this topic but I agree that B/A could do some good changes in my lifestyle"
tl;dr : If you are trying to be 100% neutral your goals are basically dead weight so it's better to show what you care even on the lowest degree.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:05:21 on October 19, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
if the explanation takes two hours to explain and still leaves everyone confused, they aren't worth explaining to. changing them to your side changes nothing except the pointless opinion a/b are talking about. better to say they are stupid and work on c.
that way they atleast have the possibility of shutting the fuck up and realising that C might be better after all. But if i remain quiet, a/b may never realize option c exists. i'm not going to bother with adding a and b to my already hopeful c, when i know a and b are worthless. the chore of explaining that to two people who are too dimwitted to even contemplate the existence of c makes it obviously smarter to just say ur both wrong and walk away.
let's say u say nothing and walk away. they will never know of C and may never end their argument.
let's say u joined in. now ur wasting time and from the outside looking in. ur just as stupid as a and b and going to be ignored.
tell a and b they r wrong and work on the solution. from the outside looking in, a/b are fucking up and arguing while c is making an example and excelling where they couldn't. now the outside many see results, unlike if they somehow listened to u amongst the opinion of two idiots. a and b may exhaust themselves and see wtf ur doing or inquire as to what they were proposing for C.
can a and b's opinion be changed. trying to change it before then is a waste of effort.
Stop taking it so seriously jesus christ, if you really think that C's is the one that excells, so do A and B. That's why they are arguing on the first place.
It's obvious that some A/B/C.../Z don't want to change their opinions, but if they do, and they ask for yours "both sides suck" it's the worst thing to say, no one thinks that your view is even close to being relevant, nothing takes more than 2 minutes to explain so people expect you to do so..
Also there's a wide difference within "The YouTube commenter who's only insight on the matter is that you are an inferior, piss drinking cuck if you don't like A" and "Your co-worker Greg who doesn't understand why those who hate A can't see that B is doing the same, but stills thinks that A is better"
It's obvious who's the one you can talk to and who's the one who can't hold a topic for 10 seconds
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 01:17:35 on October 20, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
and then there's the guy who's willing to let you continue thinking ur argument is worth arguing lol. u just assume we're the 10 second guys. we're just a few steps ahead of u. like i was for a day before i decided to go back and find this thread. now we're in an argument that was just better left at. ur an idiot and not worth arguing with and ur argument won't see reason so why bother.
i tried my way it worked. we just tried ur way and got nowhere.
ima go back to my way lol hope u enjoyed that pointless banter. reflect on it in a few days and maybe ull get the point if ur not able to tonight
uuuuh you commented me first dude, and reddit mail is a thing, i ain't got to dig nothing.
anyway if that makes you feel good it's ok. appreciate it?
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 03:41:29 on October 20, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
scroll up dipshit. this is my comment lmfao. we're done here unless u wanna say ur OPs second acct lol. to what i said earlier. don't let it keep u up late.
This comment section is everything I had hoped for. You have leftist retards saying the right are racists and bigots. You have the alt-right saying immigration will ruin America and the left are idiots for bending over for globalists. You have the centrists saying "le horseshoe theory amirite". Then there's me sitting in my hot-head-air balloon with sweet sunglasses on.
Kiwipai ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:06:20 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Most people understand that their own side is a wide spectrum with many subgroups that don't agree with each other, but somehow manage to totally disregard that the other side is the same and just decides to ignorantly treat them all like the worst subgroup. Then you have centrists who manages to do this retarded dishonesty BOTH WAYS and somehow think they "get it" whit the fence firmly planted up their bum.
Is there a response to this? It's literally the worst when people say it, especially when you know they'd be even dumber in the situation they're judging.
...Asking for a friend.
4YYLM40 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:28:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No. you see, I'm not a coward. I'm a RADICAL CENTRIST.
The_Karaethon_Cycle ยท 2212 points ยท Posted at 17:49:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I can confirm that that is indeed how it works.
Tree_Shaun ยท 652 points ยท Posted at 18:52:48 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No you're all idiots
RealChris_is_crazy ยท 412 points ยท Posted at 18:55:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Both of you are idiots.
The_Karaethon_Cycle ยท 314 points ยท Posted at 19:00:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Everyone is an idiot except for me. Including myself.
haiku-testbot ยท 344 points ยท Posted at 19:00:35 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Everyone is an
idiot except for me
Including myself
-The_Karaethon_Cycle
sneakytokey ยท 57 points ยท Posted at 19:58:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I did not see TheKaraethonCycle coming lol good bot
The_Karaethon_Cycle ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 01:40:28 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's one of the less well known excerpts from the Prophesies of the Dragon.
sneakytokey ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 02:19:55 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
User name checks out :-p
ImAScientist_ADoctor ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:37:21 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sounds like a bunch of queer talk to me.
The_Karaethon_Cycle ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 05:08:55 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well you're the scientist.
The_Karaethon_Cycle ยท 63 points ยท Posted at 19:09:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Oh my god. I had no idea that was a haiku. Good bot. Maybe add a few more  's next time though.
SomeAnonymous ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 21:00:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Congrats on the very relevant username, by the way.
MailerDaemon452 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 02:05:06 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
*checks bot's comment*
*pause*
This... is sarcasm... right?
bran_dong ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 09:50:19 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
pretty much anything is a haiku. but who cares? might as well make a bot that points out paragraphs.
Tree_Shaun ยท 23 points ยท Posted at 20:11:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Everyone's an idiot except for haiku bot
Mortimier ยท 22 points ยท Posted at 20:07:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Holy shit my dudes, we have a bot that can work with punctuation!
Sennomo ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 00:07:42 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You are easily impressed. Now find a Human that can work with punctuation.
MatildaSalmon ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 21:49:54 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Blood and bloody ashes bot
e3super ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 19:56:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Good bot
Saron_was_taken ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 22:06:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Good bot
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:35:26 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Good bot
rebuilt11 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:39:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There are idiots on BOTH sides.
RealChris_is_crazy ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:31:19 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You are idiots on both sides!
tulutollu ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:34:27 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Why don't you both shut up!
SSBPMKaizoku ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 20:20:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Weโre all idiots.
Duffyd680 ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 21:00:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Speak for yourself
Hard_Avid_Sir ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 23:38:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm all idiots on this blessed day.
tkeign ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 16:30:42 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
HA What an idiot
klezmai ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:22:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Bye now.
[deleted] ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 21:22:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Your opinion is wrong because the people saying literally yhe oposite of you is also wrong, make sense?
Acarlmac ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:10:46 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The idea that people think there are only two possibilities is the problem.
gyroda ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 22:10:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The Dragon Reborn, the Seanchan, they're no different.
DiversityOfThoughts ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 22:51:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's an unexpected reference. I suppose the wheel weaves as it wills.
gyroda ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 22:55:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mean, look at their username. I think that's a WOT reference (I'm on the audiobooks so I have to guess at spelling sometimes).
DiversityOfThoughts ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 22:57:18 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Derp, didn't read the initial parent comments username. It is indeed!
Nyme_Jeff ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 01:18:52 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The worst part is that they both agree that you're right when you say that to them xD
HeatedChaos ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:27:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Y'all are dumbos
breath-of-the-smile ยท 982 points ยท Posted at 18:34:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
reddit_irl
TheArrivedHussars ยท 136 points ยท Posted at 19:30:58 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Your name made me smile :)
full_regalia ยท 81 points ยท Posted at 19:52:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Your name made me come down the mountainside
WHYRedditHatesMeSo ยท 33 points ยท Posted at 20:16:07 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
My name made me hate myself more
Combsy13 ยท 34 points ยท Posted at 20:24:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Your name made me hate you too
WHYRedditHatesMeSo ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 20:24:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Not as much as I hate myself
GodLetMeUnfinished ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 20:43:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
your name made me hate you and reddit
WHYRedditHatesMeSo ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:47:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If you hate me, then why do you hate Reddit too? The enemy of your enemy is surely somewhat your friend
oberbernou ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:36:33 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Stay close with your friends but be inseparable with you emenies
tkeign ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 16:31:48 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Your name reminds me of Bill Cosby
Combsy13 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:01:06 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Brb raping myself
supacrusha ยท 21 points ยท Posted at 20:47:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
COMING DOWN u/TheArrivedHussars TURNED THE TIDE
TheCrusaderKing2 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 10:34:09 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
AND THEN THE WINGED HUSSARS ARRIVED!
Beareh ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 23:18:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Nice username!
atred ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 02:05:08 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
ITT: everybody is stupid but me.
Operation_Ivysaur ยท 268 points ยท Posted at 18:12:50 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I came up with a great idea dude, I'm gonna play both sides.
playslikepage71 ยท 50 points ยท Posted at 20:41:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There's an IASIP clip for every damn occasion.
total4-rome ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 21:01:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think this one fits a bit better
Lo-Ping ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 03:22:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The one where they go to an abortion clinic protest, and Dennis gets pelted by both sides while he rides the fence.
Rudirs ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 21:02:19 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
/r/unexpectedsunny
These-Days ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:07:51 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
russia_irl
RunninRebs90 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 22:48:12 on November 6, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Was that supposed to be funny?
polarbarry ยท 1135 points ยท Posted at 17:31:58 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I watch Rick and Morty I don't need one
[deleted] ยท 211 points ยท Posted at 20:09:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Anotheraccountdelete ยท 396 points ยท Posted at 20:24:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
you have to have a high IQ to overuse this copypasta
creamydick ยท 71 points ยท Posted at 20:49:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
:(
MemioliRavioli ยท 46 points ยท Posted at 21:22:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
OVER 300 CONFIRMED IQ POINTS
Dentedkarma ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:58:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
900iq
Sdrawccab ยท 38 points ยท Posted at 22:35:18 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted] ยท 26 points ยท Posted at 00:52:09 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
-200 reputation +9000 autism
BadKarmaGuye ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 05:32:41 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Seriously ashamed at liking the show. Fucking ruined.
HappyPills ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 01:39:53 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
+9001 autism*
justpassingby3 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 04:40:46 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
So true. Opinions are for weak minded sheeple
Freljords_Heart ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:49:48 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Omg! Indeed! And you do understand all the hidden and subtle jokes?
Demiglitch ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 14:05:21 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Which half of the show is better, Rick or Morty?
mtyndall ยท 793 points ยท Posted at 18:26:59 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ah yes, the South Park approach
MurphJr ยท 682 points ยท Posted at 18:36:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think my favorite time South Park tried this was during the Nambla episode.
At the end if the episode one of the men give a speech about how pedophilia is a disease and that they can't help the way they act. They're misunderstood. There's a brief pause and then Stan goes
"Dude... you want to have sex with children..."
And then the cops arrest the guy. It's a great final conclusion.
vikingpride11 ยท 39 points ยท Posted at 21:29:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Probably the best SP episode too
TheWebDoc ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 22:59:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What's the episode number?
low_kix ยท 25 points ยท Posted at 23:14:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Seven
curebdc ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:43:31 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
7/11
Quintronaquar ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:35:15 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
whispers try eight
Sublimebro ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:31:09 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Season 4 episode 5.
oberbernou ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:37:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Less than 12
[deleted] ยท -45 points ยท Posted at 20:37:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[removed]
MemioliRavioli ยท 109 points ยท Posted at 21:24:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What are you trying to say here? Because I have the feeling that you're ignoring a lot of not-so-subtle differences between homosexuality and pedophelia.
Mostly the part where the sex partner is old enough to consent, for starters.
madbubers ยท 22 points ยท Posted at 21:52:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Pedophilia != child molester, that's the distinction we are working with
oiducwa ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:26:10 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
True. The thing is in no way pedoโs desire can be satisfied in any degree. If weโre horny we have sex. No one is willing to have sex with me? Well I can watch some porn and jerk it off or use a doll. These can never happen for a pedo.
I am truly sorry some people are born wired that way.
Colaburken ยท 42 points ยท Posted at 21:35:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't see how that matters when judging the pedophiles. It's not like they asked to be attracted to kids, it's a sexual orientation like being gay or straight. However actually acting on it is a different matter all together.
SimonPlusOliver ยท 38 points ยท Posted at 21:41:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
sounds like you do see how it matters
FlipskiZ ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 00:07:40 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We're talking about pedophilia though, not sexual harrasement/abuse
SimonPlusOliver ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:41:00 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sure, but what happens when you try to normalize pedophilia? What happens when pedophiles gain mainstream acceptance? You think molestation would go down or up?
Panzerdrek ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 02:02:21 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There is some argument it will go down because it encourages treatment. By making it comment stigmatized to even have those feelings, paedophiles hide that fact and thus avoid treatment.
spysappenmyname ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 21:53:38 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well, you are straight guy, and girl doesn't give consent to sex. Do you rape her?
I imagine it's kind of the same for pedophiles, exept their desired companion can't give consent. Ever.
Mine just don't want to.... But that doesn't make me a rapist, raping someone does.
boofbonzer81 ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 22:09:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Wtf no if the girl says no you dont do anything at all. The reason children cant give consent is because they are not fully developed and dont make logical decisions. So thats a no all the time which means you should never do it. I have no idea how that's hard to grasp
spysappenmyname ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 22:31:57 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That is the basic idea.
What im saying is being a pedophile is like being the most unattractive piece of neckbeard ever. It's "no" all the time.
Now is that actually not okey? Or should it be okey to have a sexuality, even if you never can have sex.
Just like being so unattractive that you could never ever have sex isn't illegal, and no one is going to suggest cutting your balls out or forcing you on hormones, should pedophilia in my opinion be treated the same way.
You would probably want to see a therapist at some point, just because inevitably that situation would suck. But being treated all the time as a potential criminal is both unfair and unhelpful. If anything, it could make you either be constantly ashamed of yourself and building your feelings, waiting to brust out, or even worse, make you accept yourself as this "animal". Both cases would drive you closer to committing a crime: having sex with someone without consent.
The reason for lack of consent consent doesn't change a thing in my opinion. It's exactly the same if the consent can not be given because the other party is underage, or if the other party just doesn't want to.
Being pedophile shouldn't be illegal, raping children should be illegal.
doublethump ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 22:34:20 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't think it's illegal to be a pedophile though
spysappenmyname ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 22:45:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
yeah, it isn't, but society treats pedophiles like they are already or will inevitably rape a child, if they find out. Politicians have seriously suggested outing personal information, similiar how sex offenders are listed in some places. Many therapists aren't willing to see pedophiles, and only few actually have sufficient gasp on the topic.
Instead of helping pedofiles to live normal lives, society pushes them out and treats them as dangerous animals. This obviously isn't an helpful method.
madbubers ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 23:02:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Just look at this thread...
Dorocche ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 23:03:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You just agreed with them 100%, but youโre acting like they have three heads.
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 00:28:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
boofbonzer81 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 00:35:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
He was trying to justify somehow.
NotGloomp ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:38:48 on October 23, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What the second reason?
[deleted] ยท -25 points ยท Posted at 20:44:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[removed]
[deleted] ยท 44 points ยท Posted at 20:50:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
....
Are you comparing gay people to fucking pedophiles?
Edit: not child molesters.
But still: one is between two consenting adults. The other is between an adult and a fucking child.
I_am_not_a_horse ยท 26 points ยท Posted at 20:52:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
He distinguished the difference between paedophiles and child molesters. It's a pretty important difference.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:59:57 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah read through the comment fast... corrected mine
IsThereAnAshtray ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 20:57:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Peadophile is somebody with a sexual attraction to children, something that has been pretty much agreed upon is out of a persons control.
A child molester is someone who molests children, and has no place in society.
What OP is saying, is that it's not fair to demonized a group of people who has thoughts out of their control and have not acted on them.
barafyrakommafem ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 20:56:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Are you misunderstanding him on purpose or do you not get what he was saying?
SexyMrSkeltal ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 21:23:20 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Nobody's saying we should let adults fuck kids, they're just acknowledging that it's an attraction they have no control over, which is true for both gays and pedophiles.
Colaburken ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 21:37:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, why not? Both are sexual orientations, regardless of whom they are attracted to as they can't help it. Actually acting on it is a different topic, however.
[deleted] ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 22:01:45 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Then why not compare straight people with paedophiles? They're both just sexual orientations right?...
There's literally no reason to "compare" homosexuality and paedophilia in this context without some sort of implicit implication that homosexuality is some kind of deviant behaviour.
HailSanta2512 ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 23:36:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Colaburken ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:02:47 on October 20, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Because both are sexual deviations from norm (as in, the majority). Comparison to homosexuality makes also more sense as it was controversial before.
Virtymlol ยท 42 points ยท Posted at 20:51:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's always funny seeing people without basic knowledge over a subject.
Gay people, implies consenting adults having consensual sexual relationships.
Pedophiles, even without acting on it, implies wanting a sexual relationship with a minor that cannot consent to it.
In no way, shape or form, are those two comparable.
IsThereAnAshtray ยท 33 points ยท Posted at 21:00:18 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
They are two forms of sexual attraction that is out of a persons control. What is in their control is the ability to act on it, so you can absolutely compare homosexual attraction to pedophilia, but you cannot compare gay sex with child molestation.
[deleted] ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 20:55:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
How are sexual prefferences not comparable?
danny29812 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:02:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What is different from two consenting adults having sex and an adult sexually abusing a minor?
Wow, let's chuck all rapists, necrophiliacs, and beastialitist(?) In there too, it's just sex after all /s
If you really can't see the difference between "sexual preference" and literal sexual abuse, there is something seriously wrong between your ears.
madbubers ยท 21 points ยท Posted at 21:06:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's why the discussion is about pedophiles not child molesters
boofbonzer81 ยท -4 points ยท Posted at 22:13:26 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Thats what he is saying. It is never right to be attracted like that towards children, they cant give consent. If you are some reason attracted to children its not a "sexual prefernce," youre just sick.
madbubers ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 22:30:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
So people can control their sexual attractions now?
danny29812 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 23:05:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No, however we can all agree being attracted to children is wrong on so many levels. We (hopefully) can all agree that there is a distinct difference between being attractedโ to an adult is acceptable and being attracted to a child is not.
HailSanta2512 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 23:40:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Not a single person in this thread has said that being attracted to children is acceptable. You're arguing with a strawman while advocating that paedophiles (again, not child molesters) should be demonised instead of helped.
Dorocche ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 23:06:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And yet those sick people cant go get medical help because people are demonizing them for something utterly out of their control.
boofbonzer81 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:46:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes they can go get helped.
Dorocche ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:26:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
They physically can, but when everybody has that attitude they wonโt.
Virtymlol ยท -4 points ยท Posted at 21:09:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Okay let's try and do something.
What is comparable between, a victimless relationship between two consenting adults (that happen to be of the same sex) and an adult having sex with a minor ?
Let's see the differences first.
Consent, one is consensual, the other by default cannot be consensual as a minor does not have the ability to consent.
One has no victim, other one has a de facto victim.
One involves love, the other does not. A minor by essence does not experience love the same way, this is the reason laws protect them and their consent.
Now what are similarities ?
So according to you, using broad terms, like : illegal, would make it pertinent to compare torrenting a song and murdering a whole family.
After all they fall under the same word, right ?
madbubers ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 21:17:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You are having a fundamental misunderstanding of his argument, there is no relationship involved.
Virtymlol ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 21:32:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm not actually. I understand him and the others are arguing using the difference between an attraction, and acting on it.
Except everything I said applies to the attraction just the same. I didn't use the term of illegal or any legal definition, because paedophilia is simply not illegal, it does not imply acting on it.
However that does not refute anything I said.
The attraction is still toward a different object than homosexuality, and all my points apply.
Pedophiles are indeed attracted to prepubescent, that still cannot consent, that are unable to reciprocate the love fully.
madbubers ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 21:36:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Oh so you can change who you're attracted to? The gays will be delighted to hear.
Logic_and_Memes ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:56:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
gr8 b8 m8
HailSanta2512 ยท -4 points ยท Posted at 21:08:57 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It wasn't supposed to be bait but brainlets managed to bite down anyway
Logic_and_Memes ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 21:21:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Your comment was written is a very condescending manner and therefore is unlikely to properly convey the message you want it to.
HailSanta2512 ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 21:31:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's fair criticism. Original post has been changed to (hopefully) convey my point a bit better.
Logic_and_Memes ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 22:28:10 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Your new edit is an improvement.
The_cynical_panther ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:00:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Classic reddit
user_48217 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:32:27 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Oooh you're gonna say crucified for that. Still gonna take a couple decades before the idea starts getting through.
HailSanta2512 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:37:19 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
-34 and plummeting :^)
madbubers ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:51:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Looks like I'm about to join you
doodlyDdly ยท 91 points ยท Posted at 22:16:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Giant meteor 2016 Hahahaha! I am more enlightened then both of you.
[deleted] ยท 248 points ยท Posted at 19:18:18 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
NlNTENDO ยท 37 points ยท Posted at 22:12:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mean, Parker is a registered Libertarian. Helps explain the term, "South Park Republican."
Turtlefast27 ยท 281 points ยท Posted at 20:31:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Libertarians are so goddam smug it pisses me off.
[deleted] ยท 90 points ยท Posted at 20:40:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Did you just try to violate my NAP?
McSethicson ยท 47 points ยท Posted at 20:59:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm coming at your house in a fucking tank now
Generic_Username4 ยท 43 points ยท Posted at 21:31:54 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Good luck buddy, my house is private property.
[deleted] ยท 29 points ยท Posted at 21:02:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'll have my McTomahawk missile ready
adams_things ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 06:54:05 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
the mcmarines are approaching your house as we speak
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 01:14:12 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ummm actually it's a homestead and it's completely legal.
lal0cur4 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 00:54:59 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Cut across my lawn? I'm breaking out the recreational nukes.
getMeSomeDunkin ยท 198 points ยท Posted at 20:39:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
They don't have a lot of proof that their ideas work today, so they can point to anything broken and say their way would be better.
MeshesAreConfusing ยท 155 points ยท Posted at 20:45:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And if privatizing the thing didn't work, it must have been due to government interference. Clearly we must privatize more things until it starts working.
SexyMrSkeltal ยท 70 points ยท Posted at 21:28:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Oh and no taxes ever, but everything funded by taxes must remain free, can't have kids paying for public school or to drive on every street.
voksul ยท 27 points ยท Posted at 00:28:57 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Libertarian Economics:
Everything going to shit is an undesirable outcome for all parties, so they obviously wouldn't let everything go to shit. Forget market failures, friction, information asymmetry, and just plain old greed, nothing bad can ever happen in a libertarian paradise because bad things are bad.
adams_things ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 06:51:25 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
sweats furiously
yeah but uhhh uh um so uh
takes sip of mtn dew code red 2 liter
market forces dude come on man it's supply and demand you dont understand economics
shovels handfull of cool ranch doritos into mouth
listen dude if you dont agree with me it's because you're stupid man
belches inside mouth, scent of mtn dew code red mixed with cool ranch fills room
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 06:46:22 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
muh NAP
Admiral_Yang_Wen-li ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 00:20:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah. Libertarians would want people to pay for those. None of them who want to privatize the roads or schools think they should still be free.
Marsmar-LordofMars ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:39:49 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
People already do through taxes.
estonianman ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 03:48:05 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Or we shut down the schools and sell the roads.
I am fine with that.
Proceeds returned as a tax credit.
brodievonorchard ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 08:30:14 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Just in time, since you'll now have to pay a toll on every road, and tuition for your kids.
estonianman ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:17:08 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sometimes. Although building a road has other advantages as well - it raises property values along them, allowing for commercial leasing. Offset the sales and gas taxes that are supposed to go to roads and probably don't and I bet there is savings.
It already happens. I own a home and pay a decent amount of property tax. It has been shown that a student attending public school costs twice as much as one attending private, $6000 a head in public school versus $3000 in private. The reason private school are expensive is that you are forced to pay for public school - and if you send your kid to private the cost is added on top of what you already pay in tax. Offset the tax like we do in AZ and the math works.
anymore emotional arguments to present comrade?
Marsmar-LordofMars ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:38:47 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If only we got rid of government oversight and regulation, things would be better.
Children of Thalidomide? What the fuck are those? The entirety of the working conditions of the Industrial Revolution? You speaking French, bro?
MeshesAreConfusing ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:40:32 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
what's a history
estonianman ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 03:47:22 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It works.
SexyMrSkeltal ยท 39 points ยท Posted at 21:27:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I've heard them argue that employees are less likely to be of help if they work for the government than if they worked for a private business, because they have no incentive to keep a customers business.
Apparently none of those fucks have ever been to Walmart, because I've never seen an employee give a damn. The only people in the private sector that give a shit are the bosses and owners who actually profit from it, and they're going to cut as many damn corners as they can to make more.
Ltkeklulz ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 23:13:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's why I like things like ESOP. It passes the profits on to the employees and creates incentives to make the company do well. Of course, that doesn't really apply to cashiers at Walmart since they don't have anything like that.
ghostmeatloaf ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 23:33:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Walmart has stock options. Dunno if it's an esop. Also has store performance based quarterly bonuses.
It's not much but it's something.
[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 22:15:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well, you just answered yourself. Give the worker a piece of the action if they benefited the employer. People take better care of shit when they own it.
rkhpr6400 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 13:52:09 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
So worker owned means of production? Just cut out the middle man of the employer
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:54:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Doesn't need to be full ownership, just enough of piece to see the benefit of doing a good job.
rkhpr6400 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 15:08:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But why? What does the boss actually do that the employees can't? Wouldn't the employees do an even better job if they were doing something for them and not for some random rich asshole
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:55:01 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Good management is essential to successful business. Prioritizing your effort is hard at entry level as you should be focusing on the individual tasks in detail, so having someone to direct is important.
vy2005 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 19:26:12 on October 19, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Are you saying the entire concept of management isnโt important?
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 03:19:04 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What's funnier is EVERY. SINGLE. FUCKING. PRESIDENTAL. ELECTION. they're convinced that running a candidate that inherently appeals to a small niche of the population will somehow win the plurality of votes and get along with Congress and accomplish what they want even when they haven't even won a single House or Senate seat before, or Governorship. The ones who aren't batshit insane ironically admit their true goal is to reach the 5% threshold to receive Federal funding in order to better their odds in the next election. Think about that for a second: a political party that's focused on limiting government aid and regulations has its primary electoral goal to get enough votes to get federal funding and debate time even though they can theoritically get around those two on their own if they were truly more popular.
estonianman ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 03:49:35 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The majority of economy is based on voluntary transactions so yeah - it absolutely works.
bromeatmeco ยท 26 points ยท Posted at 21:48:57 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Marxists do the same thing, and Marxist-Leninists have plenty of proof their ideas don't work.
ReallyBadAtSpelling ยท 53 points ยท Posted at 22:39:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Good thing there are more options than libertarianism and Marxism.
CyberDiablo ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 05:11:50 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Like libertarian Marxism.
ReallyBadAtSpelling ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 05:27:26 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
For the love of all that is holy please don't let them know that this is a real thing.
adams_things ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:53:07 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
anarcho-stalinism
CyberDiablo ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:00:37 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I was rather thinking of autonomism and situationism.
bromeatmeco ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 23:41:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I didn't mean to imply that, just that that type of behavior is common among people with fringe views.
Zekeachu ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 04:09:15 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Good thing there's more than Orthodox Marxism or Marxism-Leninism to the far left.
Devilrodent ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:08:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, they cause an awful amount of headaches among even the left
Lazerc0bra ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 23:08:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Something something Paris Commune, something something, Stalin betrayed the revolution, something something, you're a bootlicker, etcetera.
Pleasant_weather ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 23:51:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"If I say 'blah blah blah' before their argument, that invalidates It! I'm so smart!"
Lazerc0bra ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:08:13 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's a joke you troglodyte
Pleasant_weather ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 04:40:06 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I know u r bro
Damian4447 ยท -11 points ยท Posted at 20:57:57 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
deleted What is this?
The_cynical_panther ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 21:01:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_Era
Muffinator4 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:43:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sometimes I forget that there are people who will unironically defend Roosevelt
Damian4447 ยท -6 points ยท Posted at 21:04:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
deleted What is this?
The_cynical_panther ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 21:10:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
A) the government had to step in and fix a lot of things that were broken due to rampant privatization and laissez fair economic policies
B) the government did a very good job of fixing said issues
The United States has already tried libertarianism. It did not go well. Apparently it takes about 100 years to forget these lessons.
[deleted] ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 20:52:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I can think of way smugger groups on the political landscape in 2017..
No I'm not a libertarian
[deleted] ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 20:35:27 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
10art1 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:25:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ew, the LP is literally the worst. Libertarians and the LP are natural enemies. Like commies and libertarians. Or fascists and libertarians. Or libertarians and libertarians. Damn libertarians! They ruined libertarianism!
user_48217 ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 20:47:02 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
They used to be the most annoying political group on the internet.
TheHighestEagle ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 12:08:06 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Now that award goes to over sensitive liberals.
user_48217 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 14:06:28 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Lol. Not exactly.
TheHighestEagle ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:08:29 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
lol yes exactly.
nwilz ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 20:45:51 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
but trey parker and matt stone are libertarians
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:35:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TttI60-mjQ
lava172 ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 20:34:07 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I miss when the show was funny and not preachy
svartanejlikan ยท 73 points ยท Posted at 21:47:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
When was that? They blasted Al Gore and climate change like 15 years ago.
chucktestlacoil ยท 27 points ยท Posted at 22:17:51 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'd say seasons 1-6 are mostly apolitical. Yeah there's a few episodes inter-mixed with political messages, but that wasn't the point of the show.
ScenicSlut ยท 31 points ยท Posted at 22:41:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
theres an episode in season 3(?) where they say that being able to sue over sexual harassment in the work place/schools is fascism. It was always there, they just tended to use it as small jokes instead of the entire basis for the entire episode.
SgtPeppersFourth ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 22:38:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
AGREED. Nowadays the writers are so caught up with the "ONE WEEK TO AIR" and everything has to be sooo fucking topical. Now it's like "how many issues du jour can we fit into one episode, then just have Randy yell absurd things really loudly over and over again for all the fanboys".
lava172 ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 21:56:48 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Even then it still was comedic back then, now the show just feels like a soapbox with a couple jokes thrown in
Gemuese11 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 08:16:54 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I am surprised every two years or so when I hear it's still on.
Nathan_Sexplosion ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 20:15:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
wut? They literally use the 20 minute episode to further explain
Razatappa ยท 84 points ยท Posted at 21:37:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's always the same conclusion though. Both sides are dumb and extreme. Showing any level of passion for a cause you believe in makes you an idiot.
You'd be surprise how big of an impact that viewpoint has implanted itself into society.
SharkFart86 ยท 28 points ยท Posted at 00:18:45 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yep. It's a lazy way to feel smart and superior without the hassle of understanding anything or doing anything.
Razatappa ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 00:44:33 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And it's pretty damaging and problematic in the long run. South Park is watched by a lot of people, and there is no doubt a lot of those said people end up taking this approach to a lot of social or political issues where if you attack both sides, you're actually the better person because you're free from the association of either side's worst people.
However, that kind of thinking is ultra dangerous and regressive because it creates complacency for problematic groups and people to waltz in with small resistance because of the subconsciously instilled idea that fighting against them makes you look as bad as the over exaggerated people in South Park.
I mean, hell, look at what happened in Charlottesville. There's a massive amount of people who aren't alt-right who are failing to see the problem with the fact that literal Nazis are walking through America because "well, the counter protesters are also being violent and weren't supposed to be there!" so that must mean that they're as bad as the people in the alt-right/white nationalist/nazi camp.
While it is far from being the blame for people thinking both sides should be equally condemned for what happened during the protests, it's a fair assessment that the show has helped normalize that kind of thinking as appropriate or the "best approach" for handling like-wise situations such at the one I gave as an example.
Nathan_Sexplosion ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:54:55 on October 20, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I get what you're saying but without any data to back it up, that's just your opinion.
People could even argue the opposite stance, that South Park gives the audience a look at two sides and leaves it up to you to decide what's best. You weigh your options and think critically.
I stand by what I said. Matt and Trey are not like this meme at all because they paint the whole picture, or as much as they can in 20 minutes, or an overarching story-line.
Some people can interpret it like you do or the complete opposite as you. That doesn't mean that the show shouldn't exist. Or that it's ruining your utopian society.
Thot_Crusher ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:50:16 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is this pasta?
Razatappa ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 02:56:28 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
...no?
Thot_Crusher ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 03:10:08 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sure looks like pasta
Razatappa ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 03:23:28 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Does anything decently written that you disagree with automatically look like copypasta in your eyes?
Thot_Crusher ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 03:28:45 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You seem to have a high IQ. Do you watch Rick and Morty?
trowawufei ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 03:22:08 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
People have become dangerously conditioned to follow the Golden Mean Fallacy.
hendrix67 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:47:23 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Thats an oversimplification of what they usually say, but they are definitely guilty of this to a certain extent.
[deleted] ยท -112 points ยท Posted at 19:42:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
willy_tha_walrus ยท 118 points ยท Posted at 19:48:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Reddit loves South Park what
[deleted] ยท 23 points ยท Posted at 20:38:50 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
supacrusha ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 20:50:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What a guy.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 00:58:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think heโs autistic
LeaChan ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:40:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Me too thanks
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 03:03:52 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Y...you too
JohnP93 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:06:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If only there were some system in place to gauge the general attitudes of the community. Perhaps some sort of points system?
no_thats_bad ยท 58 points ยท Posted at 19:49:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
h o w u n i q u e a n d o r i g i n a l
Dumeck ยท 34 points ยท Posted at 19:58:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You seem like the one with the stick up your ass.
TheLastWatermelon ยท 38 points ยท Posted at 19:57:20 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
South Park makes fun of conservatives as much as liberals you stupid redneck, and I haven't seen anyone on either side getting mad at it, anyone who does is almost as stupid as you.
[deleted] ยท -38 points ยท Posted at 19:59:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
AnorexicBuddha ยท 70 points ยท Posted at 20:04:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Because that was the only outrage you were interested in looking for.
TheLastWatermelon ยท 29 points ยท Posted at 20:02:26 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Because you're an idiot that probably surrounds himself with bullshit that enforces your opinions and conveniently forget everything that goes against them
[deleted] ยท -9 points ยท Posted at 20:19:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Sablguy ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 20:27:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
his point is that reddit n most sites that u follow people or subscribe to stuff are echo chambers; since u only follow certain content, youll usually only get a certain opinion
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:30:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Sablguy ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 20:30:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
mate i said usually, this sub doesnt generally have a certain political opinion, so here is one of the places youll find disagreement
TheLastWatermelon ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:27:46 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I haven't seen anyone on Reddit recently get offended by South Park because almost everyone knows it's a joke, you have to seriously be looking to find that. If you've watched South Park at all you'd see it makes fun of shit like Jesus, gun-owners and Conservatives all the time. And yes, based on your username and a glance at your post history you're a dumb redneck.
gyroda ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:15:27 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Mate, people all over the political spectrum get upset about south park all the time.
And having criticisms of south park is not the same as getting upset by it, nor does getting upset by it automatically make your points invalid.
MEGA_FIST ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:14:04 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's weird because Reddit would give Jon Stewart and other Daily Show alum a free pass because it's "just comedy" - even though they have the same reach and network as SP and are no less biased politically.
Like how fragile do you have to be to on a rant when a single voice out of dozens make political jokes that you don't agree with?
goldengenitalia ยท 41 points ยท Posted at 20:46:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I can relate to this because I also have a giant testicle on my head
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 03:29:29 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Name checks out
Rampage_trail ยท 478 points ยท Posted at 16:54:35 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Miss me with that partisan shit.
htmlcoderexe ยท 98 points ยท Posted at 18:40:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
SimMac ยท 21 points ยท Posted at 22:04:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
tbf
htmlcoderexe ยท 34 points ยท Posted at 22:18:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
yhthavhituram
Prancing_Lansing ยท 443 points ยท Posted at 18:50:57 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/135/826/2fb.png
[deleted] ยท 73 points ยท Posted at 20:13:59 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
AfterAttack ยท 69 points ยท Posted at 20:15:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
/r/coaxedintoasnafu
Prancing_Lansing ยท 69 points ยท Posted at 20:38:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, they're called counter-signal memes, or "smuggies." I don't know if there's a subreddit for them or anything. Here's an album of some tho.
As others have noted below, this is an album of smuggies from /pol/, so a lot are pretty outrageous. But yes, there are a ton of these which is why you recognize the style.
LogicalShark ยท 82 points ยท Posted at 21:04:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm not sure if those are ironic or actual strawmen
ebilgenius ยท 142 points ยท Posted at 21:14:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's ok, I've got one for that too
PurWhip ยท 67 points ยท Posted at 22:06:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
https://imgur.com/sHO60H2
kpingvin ยท 77 points ยท Posted at 21:13:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's /pol/, so the latter.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 01:10:35 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
ElagabalusRex ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 22:53:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's the wonderful thing about the post-GamerGate world. Jokes can appeal to different people on different levels of irony.
[deleted] ยท 38 points ยท Posted at 23:42:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:37:27 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah that's always been going on
[deleted] ยท 167 points ยท Posted at 21:01:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Most of these are fucking retarded.
MemioliRavioli ยท 104 points ยท Posted at 21:27:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
They're like weaponized strawmen.
ebilgenius ยท 50 points ยท Posted at 21:13:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
These ones are from /pol/, so yeah, gonna be a mixed bag.
[deleted] ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 21:23:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
These are all super strawman, but I love 'em.
voksul ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 00:30:48 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
They're from /pol/. Of course they're retarded.
CH0AM_N0MSKY ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 03:41:00 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Counter-signal memes. The ones that aren't from /pol/ are pretty good, but most are from /pol/
SynisterSilence ยท 45 points ยท Posted at 22:01:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Why should I be forced to act like I support a side I don't?
The logic against neutral or non-partisan stances can so easily be turned against itself "I always have to choose a side so I don't look weak, etc., etc."
Devilrodent ยท 48 points ยท Posted at 23:09:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Being undecided is different from being intentionally centrist to act superior
Nebula153 ยท 50 points ยท Posted at 22:38:21 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You don't have to, it's just that a lot of people act like they're above everyone for not picking a side.
Stackhouse_ ยท -4 points ยท Posted at 23:13:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Maybe thats your inner self feeling insecure because you know you're wrong
[deleted] ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 00:44:47 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Haha thatโs exactly how the cartoon guy would talk good impression
Spacedrake ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 22:59:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think it's more that, in our current political landscape, one of the sides has fucking nazis and yet there are still people who are saying "well hold on let's listen to both sides now". You don't have to be an extreme leftist, just, be willing to recognize and ideally act against an evil in the world.
RegisRohellecTerzief ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 23:55:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You can be on the right and hate nazis lol. It doesn't seem very leftist to demonize an entire group because of the opinions of a few
Spacedrake ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 02:30:19 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Just the people who knowingly share opinions with nazis
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 23:39:05 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I guess the world is a pretty simple place when one side has Nazis.
igorchitect ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 00:32:33 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
https://m.imgur.com/a/v2cV0
johnsonthedick ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 20:20:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
that's actually really sad and pathetic. I hadn't even considered that to be the case until now. jeez.
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:40:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There's a FB meme page called Bad Memes for Bad Boys with Bad Politics with similar kinds of cartoons and it's great
Penguinswin3 ยท 118 points ยท Posted at 20:35:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
FUCKING RADICAL CENTRISTS REEEEEEE
[deleted] ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 22:35:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[removed]
F6_GS ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 23:11:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We should start with figuring out what the sides are in the first place.
SharkFart86 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 00:25:14 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And stop drowning everything in derailing rhetoric. Example: abortion. The right claims the left wants to kill babies, the left claims the right want control over women's decisions. Neither is the actual issue. What each side actually disagrees with is whether or not an embryo is a person. And since the concept of personhood is abstract and subjective, your stance is entirely based on opinion.
Zekeachu ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 06:07:22 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But... that one is true. The strongest and most common pro choice arguments don't really care about the personhood of the fetus, they care about bodily autonomy.
BForBandana ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 00:48:03 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Pronounced dead when no heartbeat, pronounced alive when heartbeat?
lal0cur4 ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 01:00:29 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We don't even consider grown ass people with heart function human, people with no brain activity that are still "alive" have their organs harvested. Why hold fetuses to a different standard?
BForBandana ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:47:35 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's a false equivalence. You're talking about where we consider the beginning and ending of being a "human" and people that have gone through an awful life "ending" experience that leaves them braindead and unable to recover or live an even remotely normal life. They aren't the same.
SharkFart86 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 04:57:21 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think a better example would be miscarriages. It's crushing and awful when they happen, but we don't mourn the loss in the same way as we do a death, because I think people inherently see a miscarriage as something somewhat different than a death. But what is that difference? Different people will tell you different things, because as I said; the concept of personhood is abstract and inherently subjective.
SharkFart86 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:54:16 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Also that's not a false equivalence. He didn't claim that taking someone off life support is the same as abortion, he's pointing out your suggested criteria for something to be a person (a beating heart) doesn't hold up when looking at a brain dead vegetable. If it doesn't apply there, it's not a good measure.
BForBandana ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 22:33:55 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Aren't they people, though? If someone experiences a trauma and ends up being braindead, they're not instantly non-human and they do have a heartbeat. They are mentally gone, but their body is still functioning. However, I will concede that euthanasia is a mercy to them. Someone else pointed out miscarriages, and as far as that is concerned, that IS losing a life. The baby dies in the womb due to whatever complications. What I am asking is, if there are easily available contraception and preventative measures to having children (assuming the people in this thread I'm debating with live in the first world), why is abortion the issue? You can buy 100 condoms for 15 bucks or even a couple Plan B pills for 15 bucks, or if you have no money, swallow or spit. Seems like people trying to pass the buck for their own poor choices. Why kill unborn children?
Throw in rape or other extreme cases and it gets a little grayer and I'll admit I don't have a solution for that other than the rapist getting castrated or killed for potentially ruining two lives.
SharkFart86 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:15:44 on October 19, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well for one, contraceptives aren't 100% effective, and many people don't find out they did fail until it's far too late for the Plan B pill. Second, if abortion is okay in cases of rape or incest, how are you gonna regulate that? It seems unreasonable to wait for the police to catch and for the courts to decide that a person was raped. So if it's as simple as asking, someone who wasn't raped could just easily lie and say they were, and we're back to square one.
And to add; you keep implying that a fetus is a person like it's a fact when the root of the issue, as I've said, is that it's entirely opinion on whether or not it is.
BForBandana ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:28:27 on October 19, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
For a lot of people it is more than an opinion. Also, I said I don't have the answer to the rape/other means of insemination so you basically asked "how are you going to regulate the thing that you said you don't have any idea how to regulate?". Additionally, part of the problem stems from both poor sex ed. in America, and another part is hook-up culture. You aren't going to be able to convince people that abortion is wrong if a great number of people willingly put themselves at risk of pregnancy. I'm not even religious but I recognize that people are hurting themselves in the long-term by ruining potential relationships with openness towards sexual promiscuity.
Dorocche ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:10:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Whether a personโs beliefs are valid doesnโt have an impact on what they are.
Dissidentures ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:42:51 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
absolutely. it's the only reason why we can call centrism a belief system
lal0cur4 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:59:13 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"Centrism" is just propagation of the status quo. There's nothing moderate, peaceful, or wise about the status quo. All of the violence and coercion is just systematized and under wraps. What centrists are really afraid of is ruptures in the social order and the crystallization of that inherent violence in a visible and public way that gasp might slightly inconvenience them.
SkyTheIrishGuy ยท 117 points ยท Posted at 19:49:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Also applies to people that say "my side is right!" With no further opinion or explanation. Add in a "if you can't see why, it's not worth explaining to you you" for good measure.
[deleted] ยท 41 points ยท Posted at 21:27:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mostly see "your side is wrong!" With name calling and no discussion.
[deleted] ยท 20 points ยท Posted at 01:15:20 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
heh shaddup cuck
u friggin racist.
Ninja_Fox_ ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 22:40:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ayylmao libtards btfo amirite
[deleted] ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 22:46:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Libtards and Nazis.
Ninja_Fox_ ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 22:48:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You are either completely retarded or you are gassing the Jews.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:40:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There's no middle ground and if you can't see that then I won't waste my time arguing with you.
Un-stoppable98 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 22:26:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Also people who just say that youโre wrong and need to โdo some researchโ without providing any counterpoint.
[deleted] ยท 108 points ยท Posted at 19:26:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Muh radical centrists
no_thats_bad ยท 56 points ยท Posted at 19:52:46 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
hOrSeShOe ThEoRy
Aurify ยท 25 points ยท Posted at 21:34:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
wHy aRe yOu tYpInG lIkE tHiS
Tutwater ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 22:14:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
hOnK
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:04:08 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
HoNk
yakshmack ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 00:47:41 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
MaN hORriFicaLLy BliNDed bY sHitTy tEXt
๐๏ธ Dangerous_Ham ยท 24 points ยท Posted at 00:22:10 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I deeply regret posting this. I thought it was funny and poked fun at people like me. It's not even about any specific issue but looking at the comments, somehow people have taken exception to this and are now very angry and have some very strong views about floating festival heads.
I apologise profusely. I will avoid posting stuff in future.
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 03:04:18 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The real me_irl is in the comments
Speaking as someone who is generally apolitical and likes to stay out of everything, I feel your pain. In the modern political environment of increasing polarization, moderates like you and neutrals like me are targets. Don't let the all the hate and fighting in this thread get you down, you seem like a nice person, and that's what really matters, not what side you take in a debate. I hope I've made you feel at least a little bit better.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:06:12 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I love it, because I hate radical centrists and it describes them perfectly.
dabmoms ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 12:29:20 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well when I wrote the text of this meme it was in regards to Charlottesville and the car attack and the whole punch a Nazi/ Antifa are terrorists arguments I was seeing online. So blame me for writing it I guess. I think thereโs benefits to staying in the middle but I also think that when white supremacists are swarming the streets you have to stand up and fight it or watch as they organize and grow and take power. They are rich, educated, young white men. They have too much power as it is.
_Serene_ ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:39:45 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No one cares tomorrow, don't be a sissy.
Ekat_clan ยท 106 points ยท Posted at 20:05:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Man this comment section is pure cringe jeez
[deleted] ยท 86 points ยท Posted at 21:19:46 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Pick a side to fight on or else you're the guy in the pic. Pretty ironic.
Ekat_clan ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 21:38:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah pretty much. It kinda proves the point of the people theyโre trying to fight with pretty well if you ask me.
hutch-90 ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 21:27:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Can't we just agree that you and the comment section are cringeworthy.
Ekat_clan ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 21:37:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes because I admit Iโm cringeworthy.
hutch-90 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:42:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Me too thanks
TheSimonToUrGarfunkl ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 20:32:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You idiots would argue over anything. Lions would be the best pilots of the animal kingdom.
[deleted] ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 22:51:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
clearly a hawk would be way better handled to be pilots.
Dorocche ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 23:14:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Hawks would have a hard time manipulating controls, some other primate is the obvious choice.
TheSimonToUrGarfunkl ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:18:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Other primates don't have the focus or the determination that a lion would have
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:45:25 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What the fuck a lion a mean really even you know that ainโt true.
elcheeserpuff ยท 151 points ยท Posted at 18:43:05 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
DAE horseshoe theory???
Viraus2 ยท 89 points ยท Posted at 20:05:51 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Everyone knows there are two kinds of people in this world: authoritarian nutjobs and indecisive centrist weenies
Natskyge ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 22:38:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
tfw to centrist to be a centrist
N_Cat ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 22:19:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, but really, what's the difference between the two, anyway.
uniqueguy263 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:19:03 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Both kinds are idiots
Generic_Username4 ยท 58 points ยท Posted at 21:34:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If one side says gas the jews, and the other says don't, we should compromise. Gas them, but only a few.
Luigimario280 ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 04:20:41 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But โdonโt gas the jewsโ is way less far to the left than โgas the jewsโ is to the right, so the answer isnโt right in the center of those statements.
Zekeachu ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 06:10:40 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
...The answer is precisely "don't gas any Jews" tho. There's literally zero compromise or middle ground to be found. One is wrong and one is right.
thefran ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 06:37:20 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
but "don't gas any Jews" is not actually as leftist a view as possible.
CAB4yK ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 09:46:13 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'd say that opposite opinions would be "Jews are inferior" and "Jews are superior". It is not a political left-right dichotomy, because not everything has to be a left-right dichotomy.
comebepc ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 06:30:30 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If one side says gas the Jews, and the other side says shoot the bourgeoisie, we should compromise. Kill nobody.
FTFY
AATroop ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 22:01:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Can we start with you?
Generic_Username4 ยท 53 points ยท Posted at 22:05:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Oh god please do
boyyouguysaredumb ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 23:22:02 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is this supposed to all rhyme too?
MarioThePumer ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:46:13 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's not just me?! Phew
AATroop ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:50:39 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
<3 never
Grandma_Swamp ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 23:23:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
This is a level headed and respectable way to solve that problem wtf are you talking about
p_rite_1993 ยท 60 points ยท Posted at 19:36:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't see how this fits into this sub. This feels more like making fun of others than poking fun at ourselves. I guess I could be wrong though... shiiiit
UNSKIALz ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 20:08:05 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's me irl personally but agreed, probably coming from a pretty partisan place
comics_outta_context ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 20:22:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"I don't see how this fits into this sub."
Spacedrake ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:03:47 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is the joke just that she's fat?
comics_outta_context ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 23:59:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"That's pretty much it, yeah."
[While I often work in additional jokes in the scenery... don't look too hard on this one.]
Spacedrake ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:37:12 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's kind of a shitty way to make a joke. No need to make fun of people.
GimbyKoala ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 18:40:31 on October 22, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Oh cry about it you fucking baby. Welcome to the internet where literally everything is fair game
Edit: youโre on r/meirl and youโre crying about making fun of people. Jesus Christ kill me
๐๏ธ Dangerous_Ham ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 00:20:21 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Honestly I posted it here because I felt like it was aimed at people like me and I thought it was funny. I tend to float around the centre and this made me laugh at how I must seem to some people.
p_rite_1993 ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 00:56:15 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah I can relate. Honestly I've kinda checked out these last few months. I hardly have the emotional capacity for it anymore. I respect those who are able to actually keep up with it anymore. I hate being apathetic, but I just don't know how to process it all (at least not in a way that doesn't just make me sad or angry).
CrotchFungus ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:29:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I can relate to this way too much lol
JukeNoNuke ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 21:02:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Mostly don't feel like getting into a big fight about a topic most people know shit all about including me.
hairybrains ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 10:06:02 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yesssssss. Thank you. I wish I could spray your comment with a fire hose of upvotes.
222l ยท 223 points ยท Posted at 17:39:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
the truth is in le middle!!1!!
kxxzy ยท 200 points ยท Posted at 18:03:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is there anything worse than people unironically ironically using "le" or exclamation marks with 1s
htmlcoderexe ยท 57 points ยท Posted at 18:29:48 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
DAE [le] unironically ironically? Makes my tendies go REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!1!11one
justmovingtheground ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 18:54:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ha ha ha. Autism.
TooM3R ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 20:06:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Normies get out !!!1111eleven
htmlcoderexe ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 20:11:26 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"This, but unironically" ironically, unironically.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 05:17:17 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
mfw
Rickfernello ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 22:44:25 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Holy crap, does that mean we've evolved to ironic ironic memes, now??
htmlcoderexe ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 04:35:38 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We're wayyyyyyy past that I think
222l ยท 143 points ยท Posted at 18:13:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes, people using "/s"
[deleted] ยท 60 points ยท Posted at 18:15:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท 48 points ยท Posted at 18:21:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I fucking hate it too!
/s
pirate_man69 ยท 30 points ยท Posted at 19:08:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I genuinely enjoy /s /s
McBurger ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 19:25:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But it's so hard to tell if the /s is omitted!
Gravnor ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 19:46:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
/s
ocean365 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:53:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What.... what the fuck is this shit
Forcey-Fun-Time ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 18:30:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's pronounced slashs'
10RC ยท 21 points ยท Posted at 18:30:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Does it count if "le" is a legit word in your language?
[deleted] ยท 74 points ยท Posted at 18:36:45 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
that's even worse.
SeriousMichael ยท 37 points ยท Posted at 18:42:25 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Only if it exists in your language ironically.
ocean365 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:53:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Le Bron
HRSuperior ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 21:32:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
this is a no french zone
kanated ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 18:26:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes, people who do it ironically.
Yellowdog727 ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 18:07:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes
what_he_has_had ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 18:15:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Probably the most self righteous and blood boiling thing I see on /r/all.
icannevertell ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 18:27:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ever wanted to be morally superior to literally everyone no matter what the context? First, turn 16, then just take no position other than everyone else is always wrong.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 18:36:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You're wrong.
100dylan99 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:47:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I've been on this site for over five years and have yet to see anybody unironically do either.
TheSimonToUrGarfunkl ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:47:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Both of you are idiots!!!1!!
McDeely ยท 125 points ยท Posted at 18:54:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I hate the fact that this culture war has reached a point where even people who hold no extreme opinions and respect both sides of the argument are demonized. Right now it's a matter of "you agree with me or you are my enemy".
canadianguy1234 ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 19:40:20 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You're right. For there is one great flaw with a "you're either with me or you're my enemy" and that is that only a sith deals in absolutes
AdamtheGrim ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 19:51:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But isn't that an absolute?
NameWithFaggotInIt ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 20:18:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's like poetry. It rhymes.
Natskyge ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:39:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
shhhhh, it's okay when we do it.
bagboyrebel ยท 22 points ยท Posted at 20:57:21 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
When one side is full of racists, then a centrist opinion is basically saying "I'm not convinced racism is actually bad".
Generic_Username4 ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 21:32:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You forgot the golden rule: fight to the left, compromise to the right.
GameRoom ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 00:23:40 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Implying that everybody right of center is a flag-waving Nazi.
bagboyrebel ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 00:37:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's not what I said, bit of you still support the current administration you've at least accepted Nazis.
TheBigBlind ยท 26 points ยท Posted at 22:34:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There are other political issues besides racism. That's a short-sighted view on the matter.
Natskyge ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 22:41:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What? You do realize that politics is not binary.
bagboyrebel ยท -4 points ยท Posted at 22:56:45 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ok, which arguments in the "culture war" have legitimate points on both sides?
F6_GS ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 23:32:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
bagboyrebel ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:45:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. The comment I originally replied to was complaining about a culture war so that's what I was responding to.
thefran ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:35:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
idk, the ridiculous speed at which people are dropping the concept of "freedom of speech" as it is nothing but a tool of the oppressor will definitely qualify, for example.
bromeatmeco ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 23:50:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You don't have to be a centrist to agree with the point though. There's more then left, right and center. You can even be a dedicated progressive, and simply not advocating violence to other people will get people replying to you with "R A D I C A L C E N T R I S M".
Todalooo ยท 45 points ยท Posted at 21:57:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Holy fucking shit you actually believe the "centrists think it's okay to half gas the jews" meme
bagboyrebel ยท 20 points ยท Posted at 22:12:21 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's not what I said. But when one side marches while using Nazi chants, it's kind of hard to believe anyone that doesn't outright reject that side isn't at least a little bit racist.
dewteliflower ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 01:02:48 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Are you saying that centrists don't reject nazi ideology? Because that would be a real dank strawman my dude
bagboyrebel ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:08:53 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well I guess it depends on what you mean by centrist, but since this thread started by making fun of people that say that the truth is always in the middle then that's the definition I'm going with. And if you think that the correct opinion is in between "Nazis are bad" and "Nazis aren't so bad" then you're pretty much supporting Nazis.
dewteliflower ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 01:22:42 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ohh ok so pretty much the people you are making fun of don't exist, unless your definition of nazi is anyone right of center. Thanks for the clarification
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 23:53:51 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Damn, you actually believe that the majority of Republicans would go around yelling Nazi chants. I can't imagine being as delusional as you are.
bagboyrebel ยท 22 points ยท Posted at 00:00:24 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I still didn't say that, but ok.
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 01:33:13 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, because by saying "one side," you weren't referring to Republicans? The alternative is that you think that there's two sides, one being Democrats and the other, Nazis. Which is even more idiotic.
bagboyrebel ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 01:44:28 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Not all Republicans, but any Republicans that support the current administration.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:10:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If you'd stop with the centrism, you'd recognise that both are on the same ideology.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:38:07 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
First of all, I'm not a centrist. Secondly, no they are not. If you really think that the majority of Republicans are pro-genocide, then you're a fucking moron.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:40:52 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm talking about democrats and republicans. And both are just as bad by tolerating nazi scum (ignoring the fact that they also both were responsible for genocides).
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:51:38 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You realize that the neo-nazis aren't taking up arms? They aren't lynching people, they aren't plotting to overthrow the government, and the ones that do are rightfully jailed. And what blurs the lines even more is that a lot of them nowadays don't actually endorse genocide, but creating a white ethnostate. Granted, that's an extremely shitty thing to think, but if they're just peacefully expressing support for that shitty thing, what are we supposed to do? I don't understand how you can believe in jailing people for having an opinion, or going further, killing them? I also don't want to jail or kill black supremacists for having the opinion they have, despite it being pretty horrendous.
brodievonorchard ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 08:54:17 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What's a black supremacist?
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 10:17:06 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't mean to be that guy, but that's an easy Google. A black supremacist is simply someone who believes that black people are a superior race to others, it's directly analogous to white supremacy. Although they obviously don't hold nearly the same amount of numbers as white supremacists, they're definitely out there. I've seen a lot of that shit on the internet, just people espousing really hateful views towards primarily white people (calling them animals and such). So my attitude towards them is similar to my attitude towards white supremacists. I don't like them or their views, but how could I possibly endorse punishment on them for simply thinking the things that they do?
EpicPhail60 ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 00:01:24 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Wow I've never seen someone as terrible at straw manning as you, lmao
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 01:31:37 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's not a strawman when I'm responding to somebody's clearly stated opinion, dumbass.
EpicPhail60 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:28:51 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, which is why what you we're doing was blatant strawmanning
Is this an act or are you really this dumb?
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 07:01:08 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
he unironically thinks bush did 9/11 so... yeah...
coscorrodrift ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 22:12:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Uuuuuuuh, no? Maybe it'd be something like "while one side is being racist and intolerant, maybe there are concerns regarding immigration policy that should be reviewed, we can't just let everyone in"
ReallyBadAtSpelling ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 23:01:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes and if you actually look at what the other side has proposed for immigration reform you'll find it doesn't "just let everyone in."
McDeely ยท -11 points ยท Posted at 21:01:58 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Look, I'm not saying one side isn't full of racists, but when 50% of the population are left-wing, you have to respect left-wing opinions.
ESCrewMax ยท -7 points ยท Posted at 18:57:54 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Fascists deserve no respect.
Centrists never accomplish anything.
[deleted] ยท 37 points ยท Posted at 19:24:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
idonthavearewardcard ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 20:50:07 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Someone who wants to maintain and propagate the status-quo.
HubbaMaBubba ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 20:54:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's a reactionary
Doonvoat ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:35:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And also most centrists
HubbaMaBubba ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 21:37:33 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That would make them a conservative, not a centrist.
ESCrewMax ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:50:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The other definition you were given is adequate, but I'll add that those "free speech warriors" who care more about your right to say something than whether you should.
leveldrummer ยท 26 points ยท Posted at 19:59:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
How about you make a decision on each problem independently of what fascists of leftists or centrists or anyone else says?
AdamtheGrim ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 20:47:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
no it's much easier to see what everyone else is thinking and just copy that
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 21:48:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But that requires thinking
skyy0731 ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 21:20:27 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But then what party do I register for? No way I could ever become a dirty independant.
ESCrewMax ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:43:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I make decisions independently, but by and large, I agree with the left.
So I should never share ideas or join groups? No one should ever co-operate on anything for a common goal because they might disagree with them on a few minor points?
leveldrummer ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:09:32 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sure, join a group. But don't blindly follow that group if they decide to do something. Educate yoyrself on the issue and try to make up your own mind. If you agree, great. I tend to lean towards a lot of what the left think. But also don't trust that the politicians. They are only interested in their careers like the rest.
AccessTheMainframe ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 20:02:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Angela Merkel and Shinzล Abe are both centrists and they've both accomplished a lot over very long mandates.
Taeyyy ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:12:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Abe is definitely rightist. Merkel is also slightly right of centre (to be pedantic)
bwana22 ยท -4 points ยท Posted at 20:42:54 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Like?
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 06:14:49 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah Merkel keeps on destroying a country and most of Europe. Good job.
McDeely ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 19:00:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Hey I dislike fascists as much as the next guy, but I'm still going to respect the left's opinions.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:09:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท -20 points ยท Posted at 19:21:59 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
PleaseSaveTheWhales ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 19:35:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yep, when I, along with millions of Americans, was able to actually have healthcare there was no change whatsoever. /s
leveldrummer ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 20:00:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Did you not have healthcare before?
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 19:37:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
GrahamPeters ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 20:30:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The fuck are you on about? The problem was not enough people had health care, the solution was more people having healthcare. It's really very simple and anyone with some level of intelligence could work that out.
Oooooh now I see why you're a centerist.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 20:37:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Valoid ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:40:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
C'mon this is reddit you have to be something, and if you aren't, we'll choose for you. Tough luck if you don't like it. /s
alaricus ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:48:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You see many children working in factories?
Gordo778 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:36:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is it too early to repost the OP?
ARAMCHEK_ ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:29:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"Both side are right, but both sides murder. I give up, so why can't they?"
-X (The band, not the Malcom)
Gordo778 ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 22:38:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I hate that people are so unwilling/uninformed that they refuse to have opinions. Not only that, but they use their lack of knowledge to adopt a holier-than-thou attitude like theyโre winning/avoiding some disasterous โculture war.โ
If you understood most political issues today, youโd have opinions on them.
McDeely ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 22:57:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Being moderate, or in the middle, centrist, whatever you want to call it isn't about not having opinions, it's about sympathising with all different sides in order to form more balanced opinions. I agree with the right on some stuff, the left on others.
I think there are people out there who sort of have their opinions decided for them because they just go with whatever their side believes in.
I have strong opinions about most things, but you won't find that they all line up entirely with the left or the right. I might be left on one issue but then right on another. So what then? If the word centrist leaves a bad taste in your mouth then by all means try to pigeon-hole me into whatever label you see fit, but I think you'd have a hard time.
It's like how a lot of the alt-right groups (Proud Boys for example) started believing in things like Christianity just because that's what the right does. They are generally from a demographic that is likely to be apathetic about religion and now they are full-on church-going Christians just because their parent party believes in it. That kind of ideological osmosis can't be a good thing.
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 00:38:26 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Gordo778 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 03:22:32 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
critisized strawmen
uses a strawman
Apparently by having an opinion Iโm โone dimensionalโ or โNot acknowledging the complexity of issues.โ Either you recognize that white supremecy is bad, or you support white supremecy. Either you denounce the presidentโs blatant lying, or youโre complacent in it. You donโt have to pledge allegience to a party, but there are quite a few political issues where a middle ground approach makes no sense. Thereโs an epidemic of lazy ambivolence and psuedo intellectual equivelence masquerading as intelligent centrism, which is exactly what the OP is mocking.
[deleted] ยท 33 points ยท Posted at 20:03:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Iโm unironically a centrist and donโt see anything wrong with it. Most of the only arguments against it are โitโs weakโ and โIโm afraid to take a sideโ as if Iโm just copping out by not being too far left, right, up, or down
Gordo778 ยท 22 points ยท Posted at 22:40:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It depends what you mean by centrist.
Do you not agree with all aspects of a political ideology? Cool.
Did you actually not vote in this election because โle both sides are the same?โ Then youโre a moron.
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 23:27:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I have political views from both sides that draw me to the center. I believe in change when needed and conservation when reasonable.
Zekeachu ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 06:13:03 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Not to be too much of a personal attack but that's so vague it's entirely a useless statement.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:53:17 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Canโt be bothered to elaborate, I donโt have shit to prove
gyroda ยท 28 points ยท Posted at 22:27:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There's nothing wrong with being centrist politically, we all fall somewhere after all.
There are two issues though. One is what OP is mentioning, those who refuse to say anything constructive and just shit on everything else.
The other is what the root comment is talking about, the idea that the solution is always in the middle and that compromise is always good. You might argue that the with the extreme right and extreme left you might find decent proposals in the middle, but that's a wide ground you can call "in the middle". The other issue is that often it's "extreme ______ wing" arguing with someone not "extreme", so the middle of those two is pretty fucking skewed. Finally you get the people who you shouldn't compromise with at all, so you wouldn't say "hey so we agree the climate is changing but not the cause? Compromise!" because climate change denialism isn't a strong argument.
Oddworld- ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 02:31:10 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm glad I get to be a centrist in a country where our political choices are "centre-right" or "slightly further right from centre-right".
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:36:07 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Makes me a feel a bit radical
the_noodle ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 22:33:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"Everything is fine for me personally right now so things can't be as bad as people say"
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 23:32:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What people think is bad is really up to perspective. I care about what I think is important.
the_noodle ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 23:48:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well you went to the trouble of listing specific arguments and implied that the list was mostly complete. I think what I posted is a large category of arguments you either ignored or hadn't heard.
Since your reply basically just repeated my comment, I'm going with "ignored"
[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 00:03:46 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You posted one argument, which was putting words in my mouth.
The arguments in my original comment were arguments Iโve heard from people about being moderate/centrist.
I donโt understand what your criticism of my comment is to be honest.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:35:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Come join us on the South East. We believe in pancakes on election day. Or else.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 19:25:59 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 20:04:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Hehe my political compass was literally a notch to the left from the direct center
[deleted] ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 20:08:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:21:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
:(
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 20:37:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:49:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Excellent image. To intelligent too not be absolute center
InMyBrokenChair ยท 27 points ยท Posted at 19:40:33 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Holy fuck youโre the guy from the post! Can I have your autograph?
[deleted] ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 20:09:54 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Pappy_whack ยท 27 points ยท Posted at 20:25:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If you have moderate opinions and look at each issue independently people get upset because they don't know if you will agree or disagree with them.
bwana22 ยท -15 points ยท Posted at 20:47:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's because it's a cowardly position. Reluctant to stand for anything except the idea of being allowed to stand for things.
Neither progressive nor conservative, just in limbo. Just doing nothing.
Contemptcontent with current everything.Pappy_whack ยท 17 points ยท Posted at 20:49:54 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't think you know what moderate means. Also do you mean contempt or content?
bwana22 ยท -5 points ยท Posted at 20:55:33 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Go on then, tell me what moderate means
McDeely ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 21:13:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Moderate: Here's my opinion, and I respect your opinion even though I disagree with it. Also I'm willing to change my opinion based on new facts that come to light instead of having an emotional attachment to my side of the argument. I hope my views inform your beliefs and we can come to a compromise and a better understanding of one another.
Shithead: I'm objectively correct and your opinion should be shut down because I don't like it.
bwana22 ยท -5 points ยท Posted at 21:19:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
So are you willing to change anything with your views or are you just going to tell people what you think and if they don't like it you just shrug your shoulders even if they are gassing people, lynching people, or have serious intent to?
Pappy_whack ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 21:27:38 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You have it wrong. The shithead lynching and gassing people is calling the person not supporting him cowardly and moderate because they don't share the same extremist views.
bwana22 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:31:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Not everyone who opposes Nazis is a Nazi... if that's what you're trying to say...
Not every "extremist view" is the same.
Pappy_whack ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:41:48 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No the shithead in my example was gassing people he thought were Nazis. Killed a few innocents, but all in the name of not being a cowardly moderate.
bwana22 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:43:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Usually Nazis who are the ones with serious intent to lynch and gas people
E: lol the ninja edit
... What?
Are you trying to imply anti Nazis are gassing Nazis?
McDeely ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:33:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Of course I'd be willing to change and evolve my views, I've been doing it my whole life. I didn't just develop a set of opinions when I turned 16 and stuck with them.
As for your hypothetical, there's nothing I can personally do about the extremists. I'll happily have a discussion with a Muslim but I'm not going to go out and become a vigilante counter-terrorist to deal with the lynching and "serious intent".
bwana22 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:37:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But moderate views don't move from the general political sphere. No pushing boundaries. I don't have set views either. I have set principles as anyone does but my views still change.
There's lots you can do personally about extremists. Maybe get up and protest? Stand up for yourself and others?
ESCrewMax ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 22:06:21 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And when this opinion is "kick out the dirty non-whites?" Do you respect that opinion?
McDeely ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 22:16:50 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No but I respect their right to have that opinion. I respect that morality isn't absolute and that they have a different worldview than myself i.e. it isn't immoral in their mind.
I don't agree with "let's throw the gays off the roof", or "stone rape victims", but I still respect the rights of the belief system that informs those opinions.
ESCrewMax ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 22:34:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And this is the problem with centrism. The paradox of tolerance; a totally tolerant society will be taken over by the intolerance that it allows.
Mein_Kappa ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 23:56:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
not at all. a tolerant society will see intolerant views and argue with them in a calm manner, point out the flaws in those views, and shut them down through that way instead of through censorship or some other bullshit.
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 21:26:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
bwana22 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:29:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Did I say that? Centrists take from all parties and ideologies.
[deleted] ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 21:06:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If you honestly believe that there are only two possible ideologies to hold strong to in the world, then you should think twice before criticizing anyone about politics and society. I had to re-group after realizing your comment wasn't satirical in nature. I'm not trying to be offensive, it just shows a serious inability to comprehend how complicated this subject is.
HRSuperior ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 21:34:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Redditor calls strangers cowardly over the internet
bwana22 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:38:50 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Person says something on the internet
HRSuperior ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 21:40:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
?
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:19:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
bwana22 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:23:35 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Political ideology is not a fixed left or right. The spectrum doesn't exist.
The issue with moderates is that they don't feel passionate about anything. They're willing to watch power be taken from them, purely because "people are entitled to their opinion". They're willing to let the shittiest people rule over them out of blind principle.
Moderates never overthrew feudalism, moderates never overthrew slavery, moderates never defeated the nazis.
jodius ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:46:10 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
deleted What is this?
bwana22 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 08:03:17 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There were several bourgeois revolutions
PaidJewishTroll ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 06:26:57 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Hey; don't blame the centrist for thinking anyone who holds serious political beliefs is retarded.
How many people have died under far right policies?
How many under for left?
How many under 'radical centrism' ?
I'm just the Dr, I didn't make the needle sharp
ViolentEarth ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 20:53:10 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Why does he need a basket if is head is the balloon?
Damn_Croissant ยท 26 points ยท Posted at 21:05:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Shut up, nerd.
NrOyEaLn ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:56:21 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Why is he floating if his head is a giant testicle?
troyareyes ยท 31 points ยท Posted at 21:21:46 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
People don't hate centrists because they're centrists, they hate centrists because they're not on their side. When was the last time you said "that person is everything I disagree with, but at least they picked a side"
[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 02:01:44 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There are people with consistent moderate viewpoints, and then there's the people this post is making fun of, "centrists" who think taking a neutral stance on everything makes them more intelligent and rational or whatever, but who never actually bother to put any thought or study into their reasoning. I'd say it's making fun of lazy thinking more than anything.
unleashedtech ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 01:00:52 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yesterday
PM_ME_REINHARDT_R34_ ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 20:27:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Centrists_irl
Pyrux ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 22:13:33 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sorry I donโt like being lumped in with the racist extremists on one side, and the racist extremists on the other. The rational non-extremist people seem to be dwindling.
None of us know what weโre doing, donโt be so full of yourself. Weโre all idiots
bewk ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 05:41:27 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Me too thanks
danielunited ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 19:56:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Sometimes I don't have the energy.
DasFrettchen ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 21:23:10 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't agree nor I disagree
starkillerrx ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 00:32:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"Lol DAE think people who don't wanna genocide their enemies have no opinions?"
AlvinGT3RS ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 02:18:30 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's truu doe, both side are morons
VolcanoDucks ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 03:13:32 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Both sides are idiots.
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 05:15:30 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
FTFY.
Zhensta ยท 87 points ยท Posted at 17:50:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
โThey have a right to advocate for racial cleansing! You canโt just shut out opinions that disagree with your own!โ
To make myself clear. I am opposed to the idea that freedom of speech some how exempts you from any criticism and is shouted as if it is the solve all rebuttal. Freedom of speech is a two way street if you open your opinion up to a public forum that forum reacts with criticism both entities are well within their rights. Rights that i both agree with and support
The point im trying to make is you canโt say โbut freedom of speechโ at any criticism to make it go away because that criticism is just that, freedom of speech.
Misogynist-bydefault ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 22:04:58 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Freedom of speech allows for the following:
Opinions
Opinions about opinions
Opinions about opinions about opinions
Etc.
Example: your opinion sucks so im going to ostracize you and condemn your actions. You will in return condemn my opinion or make an opinion about me. Its all protected.
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 21:42:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You have the right to say what you want. You have the right to call the people who have those culturally destructive people an asshole.
iampattym ยท 73 points ยท Posted at 18:17:49 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think most people agree with that, what they're arguing against is the "punch a nazi" movement.
They have freedom speech and everyone has the freedom to criticize/insult/mock them but you don't get to hit them because they say/believe dumb shit.
HiiiiPower ยท 85 points ยท Posted at 18:24:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
They dont just believe dumb shit, they believe in the extermination of millions of people. Its not like people are using violence against a peaceful movement. They are using violence against an evil violent movement. I don't really agree completely with punching nazis but don't frame it like they are just people with different ideas. Some ideas do need shut down and not given a stage.
Gravnor ยท 63 points ยท Posted at 19:58:15 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Shutting down ideas through violence doesn't do anything but set a precedent that it's perfectly acceptable to do the same to any ideas.
AdrianBrony ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 21:58:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The fact that an idea of genocide is being promoted openly already means that the violence barrier has already been crossed. Violence is more than throwing punches.
Gravnor ยท 25 points ยท Posted at 22:34:45 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
My point still stands.
comebepc ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:31:48 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Promoting violence is far from actual violence
Your_Post_Is_Metal ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 23:46:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It has always been an acceptable part of the political toolbox. Pacifism has never been the platform of successful ideologies.
Infidel6 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 00:22:43 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Pacifism is what has allowed us to thrive long enough to be able to advance to a point where people can use a world wide web to express their desire to fight in the streets like a bunch of fucking barbarians.
Your_Post_Is_Metal ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 00:29:24 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What pacifism?
Infidel6 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 00:32:20 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The pacifism that has allowed you to live more comfortably than 99.9% of your ancestors.
Your_Post_Is_Metal ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:16:25 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You really need to be more specific because as far as I can tell we've been at war more or less constantly for a while now.
Infidel6 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 01:51:39 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm not talking about the geopolitical meddling of the US government. Im talking about a society that can exist because people aren't splintering off into tribes and attacking one another.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 07:05:38 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mean when you think about it we're just in the winning tribe in this situation
Your_Post_Is_Metal ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:53:04 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What do you think war is?
Infidel6 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 02:03:06 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
In 2017? An industry. But I'm talking about day to day life in a diverse society wherein we are not at civil war.
Your_Post_Is_Metal ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:18:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Kinda shifting the goal posts aren't you? We were talking about pacifism. I brought up war, and now you're saying "oh but that's not civil war." As if that was the point.
But ok let's go down your logical path and talk about violence within our borders. When has our society ever existed without violence or the threat of it? Has there ever been no police? Has there ever been no political repression? Maybe you think some of that violence is justified, maybe even desirable, but it's still violence. All societies are built on an element of that. Just because we're not slaughtering each other in the streets doesn't mean there isn't a great deal of violence going on.
Infidel6 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 02:35:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No. You tried to derail it into war, which has nothing to do with you personally justifying the battery of another person.
If violence exists and you see it as a bad thing, then why would you choose to support more violence? Furthermore, do you seriously believe that people fear arrest because all police are violent? I'm pretty sure people are more deterred from violence by the idea of spending a significant amount of time in prison.
Your_Post_Is_Metal ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:51:14 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
My first comment. Nothing said about whether I personally think it's justified to punch people. I'm putting into context that political violence is neither new nor unique to any one point on the political spectrum. War is political violence. That violence has consistently been used to target specific political tendencies. We do not live in a pacifist society.
You don't think putting people in prison is violent? What happens if I resist arrest? What happens if I try to leave prison? The threat of violence is the foundation of the rule of law. Again, maybe you think that's fine. I personally have complex and sometimes conflicting feelings about it. That's another discussion though.
Civilization is built on violence. Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it any less true.
jodius ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:58:30 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
deleted What is this?
Your_Post_Is_Metal ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 08:22:12 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes and no. Gandhi's movement was of peaceful resistance but there was a century of violence leading up to that point. We like to whitewash that part of history but it's entirely possible Gandhi would've failed completely if there hadn't been so much violence preceding his movement. Even during his era of peaceful protests there were many instances of violent resistance.
iampattym ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 18:58:36 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Every idea gets a stage and gets to get criticized, the strong ones will withstand criticism and the bad ones (any movement that includes genocide will fall into this category) will crumble. You just have to believe that Nazi/White Supremacist ideas are so poor that they will crumble and most will see their flaws.
When they stop talking and start acting, i'll be right there with you ready to punch some people, but till then i'm gonna meme them till the world realizes what a joke they are.
And I know I have a way too optimistic worldview looking at the world in the binary of "not Nazis" and "people who have yet to be convinced of Nazism failings", but what I believe is that there will never be enough people in the "people who have yet to be convinced of Nazism failings" camp to even make a difference.
Edit: Also an addition, like every identitarian movement, they think of themselves as victims and when people punch them its them being oppressed even more (a lot of them think that they're so oppressed that the public won't even let them talk about their oppression). With every nazi you punch, you probably radicalize 5 more.
Fuzzy1450 ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 18:37:50 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Except they are people with different ideas. You should not commit violence against anyone who holds any belief until that holder becomes violent themselves. Then you can take measures of violence to defend yourself or someone else. But until it reach that point, being violent only makes you as bad as you say they are.
Let's flip the tables. You say "we should punch Nazis because they advocate for violence against people". What, then, is stopping Nazis from using the same logic and saying "we should punch <people who want to punch nazis> because they advocate for violence against us".
And to clarify, speech is not and can not be violent unless it is used in a manner that physically harms a person. Saying "we should kill 6 million Jews" is a radically different act than actually doing it. Personally, only an idiot would believe that the two are equal enough to warrant the same punishment.
Zhensta ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 18:45:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Because being a nazi inherently means you are the one originally provoking the initiation of violence? Being a poc or a jew doesnโt warrant violence upon yourself...
Fuzzy1450 ยท 23 points ยท Posted at 19:21:57 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If being a Nazi means you are the one provoking the violence, then by your definition, the right wing protestors at Charlottesville were victims of the far left anti fascist Nazis, as it was the far left that initiated the violence.
Obviously this is not the case. Being a Nazi is not simply "initiating violence". It is a set of ideas and principles that, clearly, are regressive and unethical.
I never said it did. And I agree it does not. Just like simply "believe" something does not. If a person "believes" the earth is flat, he is clearly an idiot, and some attempt should be made to inform him as to why and how the earth is round. However, you should not be allowed to ban him from speaking just because he is an idiot.
This logic applies to the "punch a Nazi" debate. If a person believes that "Jews should be exterminated", then you still have no grounds for stopping him from speaking. You can try to pursuance that person to view what you believe to be true, and if he doesn't listen, then just ignore him. But if he tries to implement harm in any capacity, you now have grounds to use violence to defend yourself.
Zhensta ยท -9 points ยท Posted at 19:30:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well the point of the rally in Charlottesville is to see the policy implemented, but i guess thats not your definition of an attemped implementation. Also โantifa nazisโ do you know what antifa is short for? Yes people say they are antifa just to cause violence at protests. Yes people use the guise of movements to hide ill intentions, but by literal fucking definition an antifa (words definition short for antifascist) nazi is an oxymoron. Words dont change definition because of your personal feelings or your own biases towards them. Also there is a big fucking difference between racial cleansing and saying the earth is flat...
[deleted] ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 19:47:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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AliceDiableaux ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:30:47 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Don't you realize that the first thing these people would do if they were in power is take away freedom of speech? The only reason they constantly bring it up is because they know fucking classic liberals have such a giant free speech boner they will let them get away with being, you know, literal Nazis. And clearly it's working.
Edit: also, antifa literally only exists as a reaction to nazis and fascists. If their hateful garbage wasn't allowed to spread so far that they hold marches shouting 'the Jews will not replace us', antifa wouldn't have a reason to exist. Nazis go away, antifa goes away.
Zhensta ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 19:50:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yo what a fucking logical as fuck argument, thanks!
Why even participate in the discussion if thats all you have to add? You could just downvote me and move on.
AdamtheGrim ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 20:04:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It's been explained to you in a perfectly understandable manner. Rather than actually read the argument, you pick out one thing about antifa and prove yourself to be a fucking moron.
Zhensta ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:06:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I called out multiple things and again that doesnโt explain why commenting insults is productive, but yea okay dude thanks
AdamtheGrim ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 20:08:11 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The irony.
Insulting someone isn't productive? Well neither is punching people.
By using violence against these people you only reinforce their shitty fucking beliefs.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:11:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The irony in literally side stepping what i called you out for. And AGAIN i do not care about the well being of people with the agenda that i should be euthanized because of the way i was born. If they get punched in the face I donโt care thats all i have said on the issue
AdamtheGrim ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 20:13:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't care about the feelings of a moron who can't possibly conceive that s/he could be wrong. I will continue to insult this fucking jackass for being a brain dead scum fuck hypocrite. If this person's feelings get hurt I don't care that's all I've said on the issue.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:16:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I asked how itโs productive to the argument? Not about my feelings? And you are the one fucking tilted for no reason. You are literally telling me im an idot for not caring about the safety of nazis who advocate commit and attempt to institute state sponsored violence yet tell me im wrong for supposedly advocating to punch them? It literally make no fucking sense
AdamtheGrim ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 20:18:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
How is it productive in reforming awful beliefs if we just go around punching people instead of talking to them about it?
Do you really not see the parallel I'm drawing here? Are you illiterate? Maybe we should punch you until you can read.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:32:18 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
To be fair have you ever spent this much time actually trying to convince a nazi not to commit racial genocide? Or is the idea of people telling them โno we will fight backโ against that idea the only time you become an advocate for the first amendment?
Otherwise yea i agree with you peace should be and always has to be the formost pursuit, but again what i am saying is I DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE WELL BEING OF PEOPLE WHO INITIALLY WENT TO SEEK VIOLENCE AND FOUND IT. Convince them otherwise? sure seek peace? of course. Have i ever punched a Nazi? No. Will i punch a nazi? Probably not. My point is the people who literally want to see me in a slave labor camp or dead are not and will not be a concern for me.
AdamtheGrim ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:41:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I feel like I'm trying to convince one right now. Do you not see the irony in what you're preaching at all?
Daryl Davis is a black blues musician who has directly reformed multiple high profile white supremacist/nazis. Just by talking to them, by using kindness and peace. It's okay to be uncomfortable by nazis, it's okay to hate what they believe. But it's not okay to use violence against anyone. It doesn't work. Psychology, history, Daryl Davis, MLK, all continuously prove that violence is not the fucking answer.
Zhensta ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:49:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
To be fair MLK was Assassinated but you are right his advocacy for peace and his success canโt be ignored. With that said i want you to understand i am not advocating for violence. I am just saying i have a right to not care or feel bad when a group that advocates genocide voluntarily participates in violence and then has violence committed onto them. It is not and shouldnโt be my responsibility to reform grown adults struggling to understand that the world is changing. Unchecked though these entities have proven themselves to succeed. I mean we fought a world war over this.
AdamtheGrim ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:02:25 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No, these entities have proven themselves to failure. We won the war against them, and they haven't risen to power since.
I'm not telling you to feel bad for nazis, I'm telling you to seek reform in the way of peace. You don't punch nazis to stop them from taking power-- that will literally only make them stronger in their resolve. You vote to keep them out of office.
Zhensta ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:06:38 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Vote to keep them out of office... i mean come on... anyway i digress. It doesnโt validate your point that the war wasnt won through peacefull reform. The means that were used to bring about its end were the only means by witch is was achieved seeing as it still took a decade to achieve including the 4+ years America was actually involved. But AGAIN i see what you are saying and we agree with each other or at least i think we do ie โim not telling you to feel bad for nazisโ
Zinogrey ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:15:58 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Youโre fucking thick, dude.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:17:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ah shit the logic wizards are really coming out of the wood work
Zinogrey ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:58:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You canโt even comprehend my logic, I watch rick and morty.
Zhensta ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:59:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Fuuuuuuuck. The pickle rick joke went straight over my head .Have mercy
[deleted] ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:17:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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Graffy ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:23:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm not saying punching people should be legal even if they are Nazis. But I definitely don't feel sympathy for any Nazis getting punched. We fought a war against them they have any more business being accepted than Isis does.
Fuzzy1450 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 05:09:50 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I can understand not feeling sympathy for them. It's a bit heartless, but I can see where you're coming from. I say that because I don't feel sympathy when their arguments are defeated.
However, I take contention with
But if the two are American citizens, then I accept their right to speak. I don't like what they have to say, but I will defend to the death their right to say it. If you can rationalize silencing one ideology because you don't like it, then anyone can rationalize any ideology that they don't like.
ESCrewMax ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 18:59:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
So we should wait until they start shipping out the "undesirables"?
[deleted] ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 19:48:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
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the_noodle ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:39:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
By inspiring an idiot to drive a car through the crowd of counter protesters
Fuzzy1450 ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 19:12:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We should wait until they try. Until then, use your nonviolent means to prevent them from getting into a position where that is a possibility. We live in a democracy. You have a vote.
Graffy ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:33:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You don't think there's groups of Nazis committing hate crimes?
Fuzzy1450 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 04:58:59 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'd like to see these "hate crimes" by confirmed Nazis. It seems like very time there is a cry of "Nazi hate crime", this is a retraction a few days later about how the offender was a member of the community he intended to strike against.
But I'm genuinely interested. If you could point me in the direction of a few Nazi hate crimes, i would appreciate it.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 07:17:28 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The Charleston shooting and the whole Charlottesville ramming thing are pretty good examples off the top of my head.
Fuzzy1450 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 08:51:12 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The "Charlottesville Ramming" occurred during a brawl initiated by the left winged counter protestors. Yes, of course, it is awful that someone died as a result, but you must understand that using it as an example of right winged violence is like giving a baby an open carton of milk and being yelling at the baby when he spills it. The baby wrong for spilling milk, but maybe you should not have given it to him.
The Charleston shooting was a tragedy, and a very good example for you to use. But I now present the example of James Hodgkinson. Far left, card holding democrat. Attempted murder against Steve Scalise and other republican congressmen.
If 1 act of violence on part of a community's member is enough to silence the community, and take actions to violently shut down the community, then both the Nazis and the far left can both be shut down by these examples.
But I disagree with this on a point of principle. They are allowed to talk for the same reason that I support any other group's right to talk. Allow me to demonstrate this principle, where it's limit lies, and why it is necessary in a free society.
I think we can both agree that ISIS is bad. That's a fairly non-controversial statement, right? Well just like the two aforementioned groups, I support their right to speak. If an American citizen is a part of the group and has not yet committed any crime, then I will defend their right to speak the ideas, principles, and goals of ISIS. They are even allowed to try and recruit. However, I believe the limit lies here; if a person attempts to leave the country for the purpose of joining Isis, then he can be restricted. Furthermore, if the original speaker commits a crime related to what he is preaching, then that individual has shown that he is a violent individual and therefore can be restricted.
This principle is necessary simply because it protects the people who speak under it. The moment you claim "this group should not speak because individuals did violence", then you can justify any group speaking using the same logic.
Let's pretend that by some miracle, the Nazis make a come back and are the dominant force in America. Using the logic of "Nazis are violent, silence them", they can now say "The left wanted to punch and silence us, silence them." They have used your same logic and have not lied in this example, but I think we can both agree they are wrong.
If the principle of free speech for all is upheld, everyone benefits. If it is not, then everyone looses eventually. Just because you are not the one loosing right now does not mean that won't change.
no_thats_bad ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:52:08 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
A democracy that is regularly abused and corrupted to the point that someone in the middle of a field can have a more important and valuable vote than someone living in a city, where things like Texas' 35th district exist.
If someone points a loaded gun at me I'm not going to wait for them to shoot me before I try to fight back.
Fuzzy1450 ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 20:05:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And despite nearly 250 years, we haven't dissolved into an oppressive dictatorship. Amazing.
And if someone says "I'm going to initiate a genocide against your entire race", the danger is a whole lot less probable. Notice the distinction here? Now, if someone says "I'm currently geocoding your entire race" and then pulls a gun in you, the danger suddenly becomes a whole lot more probable again. Do you see the distinction yet?
ESCrewMax ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 22:01:59 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
And as we all know, all republics are eternal and never become dictatorships. We should just ignore the fascists who want to ethnically cleanse America; when have they ever overthrown a government?
HiiiiPower ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 18:44:16 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ideas absolutely can be violent. I'm not gonna buy into the slippery slope argument you are pushing, you can use slippery slope to argue literally anything. You need to look at how the nazis originally gathered a following and attained power. If nazis never were allowed to speak and be seen as just another opinion WW2 wouldn't have happened.
tehlolredditor ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 19:36:19 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ok ok, but how to we decide as a collective nation of individuals what ideas deserve to be snuffed out at the moment of conception? Is this possible? Can we as a unit more or less decide "yes, these ideas are bad, and they should be eradicated, and people who hold these ideas should be convinced their ideas are wrong and they should be detained until this is accomplished".
I don't know if I feel comfortable with punishing people with thoughtcrimes but at the same time I understand that there ARE dangerous ideas out there that I would prefer would not exist.
Buzz_Fed ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:33:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well I think we can definitely start by saying that advocating genocide is not a legitimate opinion.
Graffy ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:32:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Let's start with "any group that wants to deny the rights of others based on color or gender" and just leave it at that. We're not saying you can't have those thoughts. But you shouldn't be able to organize a public rally in the streets.
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 20:11:05 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
This is where I have to agree with you humble kendrick fan. I think for bad or worse as long as they literally arenโt screaming about imminently committing crimes then it would be wrong to deny them a stage. If you deny anyone a stage it opens up the possibility of any stage being denied, then you just have a state where opinions are controlled
raeflower ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 18:35:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Make America Hate Nazis Again. It's a movement I could get behind. Appeasing those with Nazi views and giving them a safe platform to spew their toxicity ended up with millions dead. Fuck no, their call to violence bullshit isn't allowed here. Punch Nazis.
Pappy_whack ยท 34 points ยท Posted at 20:33:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
"Their call to violence isn't allowed"
"Punch them"
Virtymlol ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 20:59:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I don't really give a shit about that debate but your argument has to be the dumbest one possible.
According to you, advocating punches = advocating genocide.
Violence is a spectrum, not every violents things are on same plan.
Pappy_whack ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 21:33:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
So are the Nazis allowed to punch people advocating violence against them?
Grandma_Swamp ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 23:35:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No itโs only okay for people with beliefs similar to theirs to do that. Fuck nazis but they have the same right to assembly and free speech as every other American. As soon as they start advocating for actual violence thatโs considered hate speech and their asses are getting shut down.
NameWithFaggotInIt ยท 21 points ยท Posted at 20:27:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think your words are a call for violence (you are literally calling for violence lul) and toxic, am I justfied in sucker punching you right in the stomach? Or am I missing something?
Taeyyy ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 21:22:07 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
To be fair, there is a difference between calling for genocide and calling for punching people.
DieDungeon ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:24:50 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Who the fuck was calling for genocide? Nobody was advocating for this, at least not until the term Nazi started being thrown around.
indyandrew ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 23:02:51 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, the term Nazi just started being thrown randomly. No reason for it. Had nothing to do with people marching through the street with Nazi flags.
mattpiv ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 21:17:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We're all adults here, we should all be able to see that a non-violent solution is 100% times more preferable than violence. But there are some very few times where violence is the only solution. We tried non-violence with the Nazis before and it only allowed them to get stronger and enabled their genocide. The only way to stop the spread of that hateful and destructive ideology is to resist it at every corner in any way possible. If that means knocking a few motherfuckers out, than so be it.
Spacelieon ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 23:42:19 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What happens after you punch them, they stop?
Gravnor ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:58:21 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is this satire?
HiiiiPower ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 18:39:35 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mostly agree. I feel like you need a good balance between shutting down nazis and not giving them any type of platform and also not giving them ammo to cry out and act as victims. The very sad truth is that there are a lot of people in this country who will see a nazi get punched and feel sorry for them. Leading to them in some way sympathizing them. I don't really know what needs to be done but i do know letting them give speeches isn't going to help anything, history proves that.
raeflower ยท 20 points ยท Posted at 18:42:18 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
They choose that view. They aren't born Nazis, no one is stopping them from not being the scum of the earth. They choose that. Anyone who sympathizes with people who call for genocide has some serious issues of their own. If a nazi feels like a victim, good. They don't get to feel safe and cozy in their racist little world. They deserve a whole lot more than a punch to the face, but they all at the very least deserve that. Fuck. Nazis. Gently, with a chainsaw.
AdamtheGrim ยท 21 points ยท Posted at 19:54:58 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Did you know it's completely possible to shift opinions with compassion, kindness and calm, rational conversation and debate?
Violence will only reinforce their shit ideals and make their hatred stronger.
raeflower ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 19:56:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm cool with all of that for a lot of views. But claiming the name Nazi for yourself is where I draw the fucking line. Not here. Not anywhere. Never again.
AdamtheGrim ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 19:59:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
God I hope you're joking. This has been shown so many times it's not even fucking funny. People with intense racist/nazi beliefs can and have been reformed countless times.
Daryl Davis is living proof that kindness and calm conversation and debate reforms racism and nazi beliefs.
Edit: and what do you mean by "other views"?
Thybro ยท -4 points ยท Posted at 20:44:53 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yes that works on the small scale in the mean time the others are out there spreading intolerance getting followers at twice the rate you can convince some to turn away from it. You canโt tolerate flat intolerance because eventually intolerance reigns.
I donโt see why there canโt be a two prong approach you reach out to those open to it while you snuff out those who wonโt stop spreading that racist bullshit.
Look I understand people being worried that a slippery slope that weโll turn into a PC culture where everyone gets punched for being โoffensiveโ but most people arenโt advocating that they are advocating punching literal Nazis with Nazi ideas and Nazi methods.
ThereIsBearCum ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 20:21:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'm sure they tried that the first time around. Didn't work, did it?
AdamtheGrim ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 20:21:38 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Actually it does work. Daryl Davis is living proof of that.
ThereIsBearCum ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 20:30:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
6 million dead Jews is proof that it doesn't.
AliceDiableaux ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 20:27:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
World War II is proof that it doesn't.
AdamtheGrim ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 20:42:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You're being so obtuse it's fucking grating.
ThereIsBearCum ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 08:47:08 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You don't think that WWII was a direct result of the failure of a "non-violent dialogue" approach to Nazism?
Marge_simpson_BJ ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:43:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If they are in a clearly defined assembly and there is no question in what the specific person you were to punch stands for (white supremacy, Nazi), I won't get too bent out of shape and I don't think many people will. But the second any "anti Nazi" or "anti fascist" groups start making assumptions of their own and assaulting innocent civilians en masse, at will...the police are going to stop fucking around and I'll support them. so will the local community.
Zaramoth ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:03:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The people replying to you dont seem to understand that Fascists accredit freedom of speech and a platform to spread their hate to their rise. Nazi's take their beliefs and dilute it until its just being "anti-immigration" and "taking the country back to its roots" or explaining that minorities arent a part of the national "soul" Which gains them traction with the regular middle class enough to do shit like take over Germany and exterminate 11 million innocent people.
They also dont get that, of the couple of nazis who have been punched in the face on TV and interviewed after, they are afraid to talk out about their beliefs again. Which means the violence worked
Literally_A_turd_AMA ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:55:04 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah but there are plenty of extreme people out there going sound with this punch a Nazi shit who just think that anyone who leans right is a nazi. In fact that's most of them
milkisgood69 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:06:22 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Should people who believe whites should be exterminated be allowed a stage?
HiiiiPower ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:34:44 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No.
milkisgood69 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:16:16 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I think they should
Rustymike69 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:36:33 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Ehhhh, no. I think once one side engages in violence because they donโt like what another side is saying, then that actually legitimizes the other sidesโ case and may cause them to act violently. Thatโs what happened with the alt-right, itโll probably happen again.
White supremacist groups have the right to say what they want, they just donโt have to be listened to and can be mocked. Institutions should not shut down free speech. The general public should be given the responsibility to decide which ideas are popular based on their own judgement. No speech should shut down.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:08:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
HiiiiPower ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 21:09:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
In all my comments i am talking about neo nazis and anyone willing to stand side by side and march with nazis.
Marge_simpson_BJ ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:28:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
That's not your job. It's not your decision. You cannot put your hands on me regardless of what comes out of my mouth. You can refuse to patronize me in any way, you can make the public aware that I hold these views so they don't patronize me, you can counter protest my views peacefully or even push the government to intervene. But you CAN NOT physically harm another American solely because you disagree with them. Fuck that.
Zhensta ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 18:30:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Im all for somebody having every right to disagree with me on how to spend tax dollars to better stimulate the economy, but if your entire agenda is to see the extermination of entire populations of people... I simply do not care about your well being seeing as your agenda revolves around violence to begin with. I know that is an unpopular opinion and this will be downvoted but I canโt rationalize the safety and well being of a group of grown adults who want to literally kill entire populations of people based on their own emotional insecurity.
Side note the use of โyourโ in my explanation is being used non personally.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 19:53:24 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
AliceDiableaux ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 20:40:47 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
What? Do you realize how dumb that comparison is? A) the means of production is not a group of people, and b) taking back the means of production doesn't have to be violent.
Civil_Barbarian ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 18:21:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But we all know the end goal of nazism. Genocide of anyone who disagrees. Why even let it begin to take root if it will either die off on its own or be forcibly destroyed once it actually starts genociding?
iampattym ยท 21 points ยท Posted at 19:13:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Would rather live in a world where there are no nazis because everyone has heard of their ideas and the ideas countering nazism and all decided that Nazism is a stupid ideology, or a world where there are no (openly) nazis because everyone was too scared of big brother beating them down.
Its the same end result, no nazis, and one will get you there quicker (censorship) but only one really solves the problem and will create a better community IMO.
And I know its a utopian Idea that will probably never be achieved, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try does it?
Civil_Barbarian ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 19:23:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
But if everyone were reasonable enough to look at nazism and the counters to nazism and realize nazism is bad, why are there still nazis? And this isn't Big Brother imposing his will, it's common people like you and me protecting our freedoms. Nazism and freedom cannot coexist.
iampattym ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 19:30:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
probably in echo chambers. and yea some people may not be convinced, I'm sure there are people who will not change their mind, but what matters is that they will never gain a relevant amount of support.
Their always gonna be those 500 dudes that the rest of the country just hates with a passion.
I guess its kinda dark but, wouldn't real freedom include the freedom to be a nazi?
I mean I guess here you kinda hit the tolerance paradox, which at least right now my answer is, say anything but as soon as you do a bad action you can no longer be tolerated.
Oh and social ostracization, people should be socially encouraged to not hold shitty beliefs.
AliceDiableaux ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 20:46:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Not where are there still nazis, why are there still nazis? The whole point that there are actual nazis right refutes you entire assumption that human beings are perfectly rational beings who, with just enough/the right information, would obviously see that nazism is bad. That's just not how human beings work.
Garinn ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:13:10 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Nobody has ever asserted that humans are perfectly rational beings.
TNine227 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:08:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
There basically aren't Nazis.
Civil_Barbarian ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:29:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If someone flies a swastika flag, I'm gonna call them a nazi.
TNine227 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:31:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I mean there just aren't that many Nazis in the US. Yeah, you can see relatively big groups of them but that's just because the US is big--the portion of the country that is actual Nazis is a statistical footnote.
Vasquerade ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 22:52:29 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If someone hasn't decided that Nazis are the bad guys by 2017 then what hope is there for them?
FixedAudioForDJjizz ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 23:16:07 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
they can still hope to become the president of the United States, apparently ๐
Dissidentures ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:44:02 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
say what you will about freezepeach, a dead nazi can't kill minorities
iampattym ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:12:35 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We let everyone speak no matter how dumb their ideas and when they act, then we take action.
Suppressing speech is what authoritarians do, we value freedom, even when it sucks sometimes.
OmgKidGetAJob ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:19:45 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Then why does the government have a right to Arrest/detain/probably beat your ass if you โadvocate the violent overthrow of the governmentโ?
Because it threatens their livelihood.
Why do we have a right to beat somebody for โadvocating the violent overthrow of the Jewish/black/crippled people?
Because it threatens OUR livelihood.
Itโs not a slippery slope if we set boundaries. These are the boundaries.
Edit: changed my side, I was wrong above.
iampattym ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 19:33:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You actually won't get arrested for advocating the overthrow of the government, people call for it every day.
You can be arrested if there is a plan in place to do so, just like a nazi would be arrested if they had a plan in place to kill non-whites. Like I've said in other comments, speak all the dumb shit you want but as soon as you act the government will/should step in (and citizens if law enforcement isn't present).
OmgKidGetAJob ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 19:35:01 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Thanks for the correction! I actually agree with you guys now. Until we can prove they will take action against people, we cannot prosecute/ punish them.
iampattym ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 19:37:39 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Nice.
And i definitely see your point about defending and i could understand your worry about them doing so, but if it helps quell your fears there's so many fucking FBI agents in far right groups its insane.
Super common joke among those people to even to the point where they accuse some of the thought leaders in their movements of being FBI plants.
OmgKidGetAJob ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 19:46:03 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well that kind of quells my fears, but they were in Leftist groups during the civil rights movements too. They infiltrate any group that criticizes them. And thatโs scary lol
iampattym ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 19:53:54 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I would assume that they infiltrate any group that has a potential to turn violent.
I guess during the civil rights times they wanted to make sure that the protesting remained relatively peaceful and that there were no planned attacks that could lead to a large body count luckily there was none of that (had there been I bet the civil rights movement would not have been successful because even if it was the right thing, public perception of your movement will matter a lot more than whether or not you're right).
OmgKidGetAJob ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 19:55:25 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Haha dude, the civil rights movement was violent as fuck. Sometimes THANKS to the fbi. They instigated many violent interactions with the police to ruin public perception. Not the opposite. Iโm on mobile so I canโt link any thing, but youโve got it backwards my dude.
GrahamPeters ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:26:00 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Wait what? WHAT? Two people with opposing opinions actually came to a conclusion? Someone had their opinion changed??? On Reddit!???!?! What the hell is going on!
OmgKidGetAJob ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:28:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Iโm being the change I want to see :)
[deleted] ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 17:56:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
Zhensta ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 18:04:42 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No. I am opposed to the idea that freedom of speech some how exempts you from any criticism and is shouted as if it is the solve all rebuttal. Freedom of speech is a two way street if you open your opinion up to a public forum that forum reacts with criticism both entities are well within their rights. Rights that i both agree with and support
The point im trying to make is you canโt say โbut freedom of speechโ at any criticism to make it go away because that criticism is just that, freedom of speech. Sorry for the long reply
doorkn00b ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 19:18:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I know how to sit on a fence. I can even sleep on a fence. The trick is lying face down with the post in your mouth.
supacrusha ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 20:45:56 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Thankfully I can usually back it up, it works pretty well, the one group were a bunch of racial collectivists that liked white people so much that they hated other races, the other side were a bunch of social collectivists that believe that the opinions they disagree with should be silenced violently,including completely reasonable ones. Both sides are idiots.
Cornelius_Poindexter ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:15:34 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
When you watch one episode of How It's Made
DERPEST_NARWHAL ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:43:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
EVERY ONE IS AN IDIOT INCLUDING ME!
won23 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:44:10 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Bet thereโs a nice view from up there just saying
Meow666meow ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:11:46 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Well both sides are fucking idiots
jokersleuth ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 22:40:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Libertarians basically
kingofthehill5 ยท 11 points ยท Posted at 16:30:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Because both wont let to play on their team?
AssumingStraw ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:47:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Libertarian
Reacher-Said-Nothing ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:13:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Hi boys...
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:22:07 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
haha this is not so me irl, I'd have to have friends to end an argument like that.
I mean me too thanks
mistame ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 22:52:26 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is that MTV's "The Head"? https://i.imgur.com/gVX0L2l.jpg
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:24:31 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
You killed the >tfw to intelligent meme
supersheeep ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:36:13 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
NA vs EU
dukss ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:54:55 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
tbh i just don't give a shit
Frugal_Octopus ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:06:40 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Wayne "The Brain" McClane irl
GreatWhiteCorvus ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 02:00:11 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Duck Tales Moon Theme plays
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 03:02:21 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
When you watch Rick and Morty
TheBigMac599 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 06:57:24 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
This man obviously watches rick and morty
Michaelbama ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 22:33:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
1: "Both sides are idiots"
2: "but here's evidence that they're not"
1: "I think I'm a libertarian"
2: "wait what, but-"
-Votes straight ticket Republican-
1: "man things never change..."
SonGoku915 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 22:53:47 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Fuck the nazis and the Alt Left. As a freedom loving American I will personally fuck both in the ass with no condom or lube
Medcait ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 23:08:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
This is what people say when they want to seem smart but really they don't want to have to think at all.
bwana22 ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 20:40:46 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Radical centrism in one pic
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 21:21:46 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
wafflepiezz ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 23:48:59 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
politics have been injected into every single aspect of our lives
trt13shell ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 23:18:44 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
This can apply to any x vs y opinion scenario. Fron politics to video games to which vegetable feels the most aesthetic
furry_thrOwOaway ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 23:28:43 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Gourd imo
what_the_deuce ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 23:11:35 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Also known as the South Park method.
SerHayser ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 04:53:51 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
r/Libertarian
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:34:12 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
It doesn't NEED further explanation. Fucking look at them.
AugmentedAlchemist ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:23:41 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Anyone getting The Head vibes? That show terrified me as a kid!
Explicit_Pickle ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:34:21 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
100% meirl
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:35:54 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
https://i.imgur.com/fwjYNTW.gif
EverbrightENG ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:38:48 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
This sounds like the premise to an r/iamverysmart post
HomoCorrectus ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:06:22 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Skitz?
Jhent ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:11:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If the head is whatโs making it float then his head must be full of hot air. Which implies that heโs stupid. Checkmate atheists
Cronotrigger ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:02:40 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I'ma save this to repost it in like a year
Shadowfox4532 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:05:33 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
All sides are idiots my own included
rebornbatemonutcase ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:26:14 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We're are the mans nips
AgentTBone ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:39:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
He Definitely watches rick and morty
scrappyisachamp ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:01:20 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I feel personally attacked
Mustaline ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:32:47 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Waiting for a dick and Morty fans reference
sepukku-dood ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:50:59 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is centrist, can confirm.
Rollwasd ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:59:57 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
So, his head is full of hot air? That's how balloons work.
KuptNoodlzFTW ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:25:47 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
My opinion on the U.S. election
Rantam11 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:58:27 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Everyone is an idiot. Especially me.
-a-y ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:02:49 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Exactly
cheerfulKing ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:07:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
I sit on the fence. The grass is always green
Taiyama ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:14:47 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Full of hot air.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:15:25 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Self explanatory, I believe.
ABLovesGlory ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:35:46 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Both sides have their merits
bondo984 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:55:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The only way for him to float is if his head is hollow
doobs_mcdoobs ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 03:25:03 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The carriage is not made of brains...this is stupid.
anOldMeme ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 04:24:09 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
wouldnโt this picture be wrong? If you can float due to your expanded head, then you gotta have air or something lighter in it. This would have to mean that he is either heating up air in an empty brain cavity or has helium in it. The correct picture would be of someone drilling to the center of the earth with the weight of your brain or some representation of the weight of the brain mass.
odhgabfeye ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 05:22:56 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Wow. Wayne the Main Brain McClain from Aqua Teen anyone?
Intortoise ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:04:36 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
https://twitter.com/dril/status/473265809079693312?lang=ja
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:30:57 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
The alt-center is really just the power forward.
MrCreamypies ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 09:20:33 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is this how rick and morty fans get around?
theRandomGuy37 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 10:30:19 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
We are all idiots on this blessed day...
SupremeRedditBot ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 11:08:09 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Congrats for reaching r/all/top/ (of the day, top 50) with your post! ย
I am a bot, probably quite annoying, I mean no harm though
Message me to add your account or subreddit to my blacklist
SaltyChorizo ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 11:33:35 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
To be fair
fatlax ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 11:50:25 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
oh no has this become idpol?
senuba91 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 11:56:48 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
3edgy5me
ElementalPurity ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:24:09 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Literally an airhead.
gigixox ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:42:17 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
When you say opinions don't matter only facts do
demonsoliloquy ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:34:52 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
/r/conspiracy IRL
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 22:03:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
ur prolly that guy who everyone simply says he's not worth explaining to. if it's not going to change ur stance, why go into the likely long explanation you require beyond the obvious?
Even if you did change, ur one person which changes nothing of the bigger issue being discussed, so why bother? More fun to watch your brain implode over the lack of thought, easier to let you go on ur own tangent.
furry_thrOwOaway ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 23:44:23 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
If you managed to at show at least 1 person your point it's better than just say "both sides suck" and leave everyone confused about your general opinion, at that point you are literally wasting yours and everyone's time and it would be the equivalent to just say nothing.
Yes, A and B are both failing on horrible ways, but if A or B have done any other thing that benefits you, your general opinion should be.
"I highly disagree with A/B on this topic but I agree that B/A could do some good changes in my lifestyle"
tl;dr : If you are trying to be 100% neutral your goals are basically dead weight so it's better to show what you care even on the lowest degree.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:05:21 on October 19, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
if the explanation takes two hours to explain and still leaves everyone confused, they aren't worth explaining to. changing them to your side changes nothing except the pointless opinion a/b are talking about. better to say they are stupid and work on c.
that way they atleast have the possibility of shutting the fuck up and realising that C might be better after all. But if i remain quiet, a/b may never realize option c exists. i'm not going to bother with adding a and b to my already hopeful c, when i know a and b are worthless. the chore of explaining that to two people who are too dimwitted to even contemplate the existence of c makes it obviously smarter to just say ur both wrong and walk away.
let's say u say nothing and walk away. they will never know of C and may never end their argument.
let's say u joined in. now ur wasting time and from the outside looking in. ur just as stupid as a and b and going to be ignored.
tell a and b they r wrong and work on the solution. from the outside looking in, a/b are fucking up and arguing while c is making an example and excelling where they couldn't. now the outside many see results, unlike if they somehow listened to u amongst the opinion of two idiots. a and b may exhaust themselves and see wtf ur doing or inquire as to what they were proposing for C.
can a and b's opinion be changed. trying to change it before then is a waste of effort.
furry_thrOwOaway ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:26:34 on October 19, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Stop taking it so seriously jesus christ, if you really think that C's is the one that excells, so do A and B. That's why they are arguing on the first place.
It's obvious that some A/B/C.../Z don't want to change their opinions, but if they do, and they ask for yours "both sides suck" it's the worst thing to say, no one thinks that your view is even close to being relevant, nothing takes more than 2 minutes to explain so people expect you to do so..
Also there's a wide difference within "The YouTube commenter who's only insight on the matter is that you are an inferior, piss drinking cuck if you don't like A" and "Your co-worker Greg who doesn't understand why those who hate A can't see that B is doing the same, but stills thinks that A is better"
It's obvious who's the one you can talk to and who's the one who can't hold a topic for 10 seconds
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 01:17:35 on October 20, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
and then there's the guy who's willing to let you continue thinking ur argument is worth arguing lol. u just assume we're the 10 second guys. we're just a few steps ahead of u. like i was for a day before i decided to go back and find this thread. now we're in an argument that was just better left at. ur an idiot and not worth arguing with and ur argument won't see reason so why bother.
i tried my way it worked. we just tried ur way and got nowhere.
ima go back to my way lol hope u enjoyed that pointless banter. reflect on it in a few days and maybe ull get the point if ur not able to tonight
furry_thrOwOaway ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:43:17 on October 20, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
uuuuh you commented me first dude, and reddit mail is a thing, i ain't got to dig nothing.
anyway if that makes you feel good it's ok. appreciate it?
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 03:41:29 on October 20, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
scroll up dipshit. this is my comment lmfao. we're done here unless u wanna say ur OPs second acct lol. to what i said earlier. don't let it keep u up late.
Grandma_Swamp ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 23:38:28 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Anyone who doesnโt mindlessly agree with my far left views is either a violent racist or a violent racist enabler
BForBandana ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 01:31:09 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
This comment section is everything I had hoped for. You have leftist retards saying the right are racists and bigots. You have the alt-right saying immigration will ruin America and the left are idiots for bending over for globalists. You have the centrists saying "le horseshoe theory amirite". Then there's me sitting in my hot-head-air balloon with sweet sunglasses on.
Kiwipai ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:06:20 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Most people understand that their own side is a wide spectrum with many subgroups that don't agree with each other, but somehow manage to totally disregard that the other side is the same and just decides to ignorantly treat them all like the worst subgroup. Then you have centrists who manages to do this retarded dishonesty BOTH WAYS and somehow think they "get it" whit the fence firmly planted up their bum.
internalservererrors ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:56:37 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Is there a response to this? It's literally the worst when people say it, especially when you know they'd be even dumber in the situation they're judging.
...Asking for a friend.
4YYLM40 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 21:28:30 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
No. you see, I'm not a coward. I'm a RADICAL CENTRIST.
stevenjo28 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:31:06 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
MeSoSmart
poopyheadthrowaway ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 21:39:32 on October 17, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Relevant SMBC
Billyprice ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:07:51 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
He's floating because it's full of hot air.
Caaethil ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 07:45:57 on October 18, 2017 ยท (Permalink)
Truest thing I've ever seen. Crazies exist on every side of every debate and take every possible political view way too far.
Edgelord centrism is the worst though.