I mean, that kinda sounds like something I would write. Not in a gender neutral bullshit kinda way, but just as a general statement of fact. It sounds pretty funny.
[deleted] ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 08:29:01 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
It was definitely gender neutral, not allowed to be referred to as 'son', it's 'offspring' or 'child '. Nothing humerous about it, unfortunately.
She has always been interested in gender neutral/fluid. She has "it" in blue dresses as often as pink shorts and picked the gender neutral name "Ashley".
Sort of. Ashley Wilkes is a cis male character in Gone with the Wind. On the other hand he's portrayed as intellectual, thoughtful, and distinctly less macho than Rhett Butler, so there's plenty of thesis material on antebellum gender roles.
LuluRex ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 16:08:04 on August 9, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Just curious,how does your cousin refer to her baby? "He"? "She"? "It"? or something else?
My 10 week old human child was born with a penis... however he's too busy trying to learn how to balance his cranium on top of his tiny body to inform me of his correct gender identity... We're not quite sure what to do...
The funny thing is, in any other circumstance, you might have had a point there. Except my boss is a woman, I was a chick in the 40's, I hate everyone equally, and there's no one alive who can comprehend my sexual preference!
So in other words darthjones1, ch-ch-ch-check your privilege.
Tibetzz ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 02:22:36 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
i've never even posted on SRS bc it's a shithole. there's not a single post in my comment history from SRS and i'm not subbed?
i just find it ironic that for every person bitching about PC culture and "people too offended these days" they fail to realize that their own "safe spaces" exist and their own hypocrisy.
make any accusation you want about what my account is... but you'll have trouble denying that fact
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:34:46 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Sorry for presuming, if im wrong but checking your comment history, you have similar talking points as them. While you are correct that both sides get offended, the thing is that one is actively looking for material to be offended, even when there is none and the other is pissed because they are being tone policed like they are children.
[deleted] ยท -9 points ยท Posted at 17:53:05 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:12:43 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
Seeing you didnt accept my apology just reassures me that i was right and you are SRS-ers alt account.
[deleted] ยท -5 points ยท Posted at 20:15:41 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:23:24 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Riiiiight. I am a mature and a empathic person thats why im not a SJW. Anyways cheers to you too.
I also love that most people have that basic level of common sense. Gender Dysphoria is the exception, not the rule.
[deleted] ยท 65 points ยท Posted at 19:05:03 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I love it too, because statistically speaking, it is and always will be a boy. Why would I assume otherwise, trans people consist of 0.3% of the population. Not assuming that it will be a boy, makes less sense than just assuming it will be autistic.
I'll accept that the reported statistic is correct. However, I still believe the estimate to be high, as a result of people wanting to be "cooler" when surveyed. (It works both ways - closeted people may be more likely to falsely identify themselves as straight, but it someone is willing to report being LGBT I think they are more likely exaggerate their trans feelings. I am pulling my data out of my ass, but it still sounds reasonable to me.)
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 21:35:52 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You are probably correct. I just know this to be the "accepted" percentage, and I was trying to make a point. Even with this probably over exaggerated number, assuming your boy is a "boy" is still correct 99+ times out of 100.
Oh I completely agree with you. As soon as you're at 99%, or even 97-98%, I think it's safe to make general assumptions.
gwtkof ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 21:57:37 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm trans and being trans is not cool its terrifying. It doesn't make you popular just a target. Google "transwoman killed" or something to that effect.
Katlima ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:14:26 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm sure it's not and how it can be scary, even if only thinking about the general opinion of people I know. I can see however, that some kind of people may come up with "stories" to make themselves more interesting even though they are not affected at all. Considering the really small number of people that actually ARE trans, the topic has gained a lot of attention. But with the good things attention brings, it always brings people who are after the attention itself more than anything else.
Yeah but people also talk about wanting to "take the fight to the Muslims" and shit like that because they think they're cool and brave. People don't know what things are like until they truly experience it.
gwtkof ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 01:50:13 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That's a bad analogy. A better analogy would be people wanting to be Muslim for the attention.
The amount of willful ignorance about trans people in this thread is astounding. Yes, let's just pretend non-trans people report being trans to be cool even though coming out as trans is literally dangerous.
Also, the assumption that all genderqueer and trans people don't gender their children is just playing into preconceived and incorrect notions.
You all (minus u/gwtkof) ought to be ashamed of yourselves. Please learn about the actual trans experience before you go off spouting your mouths.
I think you miss my point. I agree with you that a non-trans person claiming to be trans trivializes the actual trans person. But I absolutely believe it happens. It's like the college girls who kissed each other at a frat party who then go around claiming to be bi to make them appear more edgy. It's wrong and insensitive, but it does happen.
And also keep in mind that when it comes to surveys, no one is actually "coming out" as trans. It's an anonymous answer on a survey so it is a safe place where they can say whatever they want - whether or not its true - without any consequences.
gwtkof ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 04:54:32 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
if they're saying it without any consequences then it follows that they're not getting the social benefits you describe.
But they are "helping the cause." Most minority groups benefit from over-representation: the greater the number of perceived people in the group, the more likely the group will be listened to. And not to beat a dead horse - I'm not saying this some huge conspiracy or this kind of stuff is rampant. I'm simply exploring "what ifs."
croana ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 09:25:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Seriously, being trans is a stupidly difficult thing to be. You put way too much thought into what people might do for some sort of intangible benefit, where actually I'd say it's more likely that people who have trans friends would say, "I'm not trans and thank goodness, because it's so hard to work through." Do you say you need a wheelchair or have diabetes because you have friends who do, and you think they're underrepresented?
oss_spy ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 13:44:46 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You've never been to tumblr then. Some circles will ostracize you if you aren't some sort of oppressed
People with diabetes or in wheelchairs aren't a repressed minority.
Matsarj ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:36:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The diabetes/wheelchair argument seems silly. I think being trans probably does have a cool/edgy connotation attached to it that having diabetes/being in a wheelchair doesnt.
croana ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 17:44:25 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
My point is that people who actually have trans friends don't really see it as being cool or edgy. It's just a part of life. It might seem different to you, because it's something outside of your daily experience. That's why I used the analogy, to put it in a more easily understandable context.
Edit: Actually implying that it's somehow cool comes off as a bit condescending, which is why I guess is why polite people would avoid making a big deal about it in the first place. To use another analogy, it would be like telling people about how many [insert: race/sexual orientation/ethnicity] friends you have to show how [pick one: cultured/accepting/well-rounded/worldly] you are.
I realize as I'm typing this that I'm trying to explain cultural subtlety on reddit. So apologies if my message isn't coming across. This is actually a really nuanced discussion that happens best in person, preferably with alcohol or something similar to help ease the conversation.
Not even remotely as frequently. Being transgender and being bisexual are not similar in the least. Nobody thinks you're cool or edgy or special for being trans. It's more embarrassing and hard to admit than anything else.
So why don't your people en large accept sympathy because you're doing the best you can with a disorder?
Your people are asking not only for acceptance as normal, but to be treated as a special and protected class.
Edit: It's okay to not be normal. You guys need as much help as you can get. It's literally recognized in the medical community that your gender dysphoria has no effective psychological treatment, and that gender/sexual reassignment is the best available solution.
gwtkof ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 01:49:35 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Were not a homogenous group that I can speak for. The best I can do is to say that most trans people aren't asking for extra rights, we're just asking for people to not treat us like shit and to be allowed to take jobs we can do, instead of being unemployed through discrimination and getting jumped on the street.
The .3% number comes from a possibly flawed study based on a small sample size and a lot of "statistical gymnastics." However, a more recent, larger study shows the number as .6% - so that fits in with the opinion of those who feel the trans community is still under-reported. That same study said that .8% of Californians are Trans. I live in Los Angeles, a pretty progressive part of the state. I don't know any openly trans people; I probably know somebody who knows somebody who is open or closeted trans, but 1 out of 125 people still sounds high. We need more independent research studies (plural, so they can compare results) before we'll have an accurate number - whether it's higher or lower than the current belief of .3%.
Not all trans peeps are "out" or pursue any change for whatever reason. Before it was acceptable most people stayed quiet about it because they didn't wanna be dead etc.
BTW I have no opinion on whether this stat is correct or whatever, this is just a possible explanation.
It will depend on how the information was obtained and how questions were worded. You might be more willing to respond to "Do you identify as a different gender than your biological sex?" than "Do you consider yourself transgender?" or something like that
There are far more trans or otherwise gender non-conforming people than we realize, mostly because it is very, very difficult and potentially dangerous for so many trans people to be out in the current political climate in most places. That number is probably artificially low at this point as well.
There's a lot more of us than most people realize. Not everyone is passable or tries to pass as cisgender, so most people assume we're really ugly examples of our AAB gender or don't realize we're transgender at all. It's a sucky way to live.
I've seen schoolmates go study liberal arts degrees in the US, and their posts on Facebook make me worry for my own country. The last thing we need in the middle of all the shit we're working through as a country right now is these idiots adding more problems on our plates. Problems that don't even exist in our part of the world sometimes.
I think all righthtinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary, decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired.
chaun2 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 06:19:50 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Monty python predicted this in Meaning of Life, so I say we blame GB
Does this only happen in America? This need for "fighting the power" on social media when the "power" is gender, sex, the penis, etc.
I realize that this is a bad example in that the person is a right fucking moron, but even slightly more intelligent people are doing this. But only, it seems, in the States. But maybe that's only because I don't subscribe to the foreign language counterparts of subs like this one...
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:50:54 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
America has 300 million people. Things like this seem more likely to happen in America, but it's just because there are so many people.
Also I think your right that language plays a large part. You don't hear about these things as often from Europe, for example, because not all of Europe speaks English. If you're only watching news in English then it'll really be skewed towards America. The EU has 500 million people, but something like only 15% of them natively speak English. 80% of people in America speak English as a first language. Native language is important because most people use social media in their native language. So while all this is likely happening in Europe as well, it's spread out over several languages and countries so you don't necessarily hear about it has often.
Where I live in good ol' yerp I don't hear about this sort of thing from people I know or posts that I didn't ask to see on Facebook, for example. It's not that women are especially free or oppressed that there's no "need" for fighting against the terror that is male genitalia; it's more like people seem to have other things to worry about HOLY SHIT:
Having time to complain about the oppression of the cock and say things like "that baby isn't a boy just because it's a boy" is privilege. Oh I'm tickled by the notion.
Thank you for your thoughtful response. I'm glad that where I live I don't have to hear about this sort of thing in social media or in life, even if it's just an awareness issue and not an... "existence" issue.
Ive been wondering the same thing. Basically only americans spout this bullshit, just like those gender neutral bathrooms. (Fyi who gives a fuck where you take a dump, as long as you close the stall and dont make any eye contact in the restroom. Basic rules.)
This stuff has got to stop before it reaches the rest of the world.
Oh shit. I now realise that my comment could have been misconstrued as a sexist judgement of her looks - that she was hot. I'm ashamed of myself so often. Apologies.
Someone please explain to me how something like your sexuality (which is a concept) is something that you're born with and cannot change.. But something like your gender (which is literally coded into your dna) is something that can be "wrong" and something you can decide to change.
Edit: I see people are down voting but no one is actually replying with a point. If you have an opinion on what im saying I want to hear it.
Yoayo112 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 16:20:08 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
Hey man, I came here to say the same thing. And my post currently has about 22 downvotes... I think this thread is the real facepalm..
The world is upside down man, men are women and women are men and Donald trump might be president. I never expected to be one of those people who are like "back in my day blah blah blah..." But im only 24 and im like "wtf happened to this place?"
The idea (not necessarily stating my own personal opinion here people) is that your gender is assigned to you, and this assigned gender may not actually match up with the gender of your brain.
I mean I get that, but how can your gender be wrong if it's based literally on which chromosomes you receive? If you have a male chromosome and male genitals then how can your brain be female? That sounds more like there's something wrong with your brain than there's something wrong with your body. And just to be clear im not like anti-homosexual, I just think it's more nurture than nature.
So is the post saying how people jump to the conclusion the child is male/female solely on the external physical aspects and not double checking the gametic make-up (XX vs XY), or is the post about people that feel that we shouldn't be trying to imprint our expectations of gender roles based on the child's biological sex?
Yes, because refusing to call your child anything but neutral pronouns not only until they can speak, but that they can identify themselves as a specific gender wont fuck them up more than just calling a boy a boy and a girl a girl.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 10:44:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
FUCK! I am starting to hate humanity!
Zymn ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:57:02 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The wisdom and insight of Sir Thomas Moore rings true.
So I just going to trigger it. Sex is not the same thing as gender.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:06:50 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
boy
[boi]
NOUN
a male child or young man:
male
[meyl]
NOUN
a person bearing an X and Y chromosome pair in the cell nuclei and normally having a penis, scrotum, and testicles, and developing hair on the face at adolescence; a boy or man.
Honestly I don't see what's wrong with this, if we're really moving towards equality then we should just raise kids as people, not as boys or girls, and let them figure the rest out for themselves.
Buying them "boy stuff" or "girl stuff" as soon as you see their penis (or lack thereof) is really dumb, and it's the definition of sexism.
This isn't even just about transgenders, even if a boy identifies as a boy, it's still bad that they're told that they're supposed to behave and dress a certain way just because they have a penis.
I get that in the current enviroment it's just not possible to avoid calling a boy a boy, using gender neutral terms for that long would simply be very impractical.
But I totally agree that we should be moving in a direction where someone's genitals don't affect the way that they're raised.
I'm saying honestly I don't see what's wrong with raising boys as "boys" and girls as "girls". But everyone nowadays needs something to fight against and we can't hurt anyone's feelings. Especially with this gender thing. Gender is a biological fact. If you have a penis, you're a boy. If you have a vagina you're a girl. If you have a penis and you wish you had a vagina, that's fine but don't try telling anyone you're a girl because you're not, you're a boy that wishes he was a girl
Being transgender seems like a disorder. Perhaps driven by hormonal imbalance or some other physiological driver. Our current best available treatment seems to be sex reassignment. For people to claim that all kids should be treated as a blank slate until such time they exhibit their status as it relates to this paricular malady is...lunacy. That's not to say that transgendered individuals should not get the same respect and priveleges as all individuals deserve. But the terms like "cis" are simply unnecessary. Just as there is no term for people without lupus, or crohn's.
Wheeeuu ยท -5 points ยท Posted at 00:30:46 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Seriously? Gender isn't biological, sex is biological. Gender is mental, sex is physical. I suggest you do some research because you're wrong. You're apart of the problem.
So what do you consider "raising them as boys"? Because my whole point was that there shouldn't be a difference in how they're raised, them being a boy shouldn't mean that they're raised in a different way.
"Biological facts" have nothing to do with this, there aren't many biological facts involved in our society's gender stereotypes.
oss_spy ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:48:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Women as a whole are weaker than men so there's that...
I never even implied anything like that, I just stated my opinion.
I don't see the point of insulting pretty much everybody in our society by calling them sexist, doesn't mean that there aren't some things that I think should be different.
oss_spy ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 00:14:28 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
This. It isn't about Trans or sexual orientation. It's just accepting the reality that there isn't much inherently "boyish" or "girlish." You can see this obviously in differences between cultures. Male and female are biological, but gender expectations are clearly cultural.
I'm a man. Happy to have a penis. But I generally fit the "normal" female stereotype of gender. I'm proud of myself and see no reason to be particularly "masculine." And it has no negative bearing on my morality, mental health, or contribution to society.
Just let kids be kids. They'll feel more comfortable and confident....and it isn't going to make us all raging homosexuals and transsexuals.
Oh really? "Naturally"? So then why do potentially homophobic men hold hands in many parts of Africa but many men here would find that unacceptable? Natural? There are no natural genders. It's like religion.....for many people, you end up being what's around you.
And remember, you are basing your assumptions off of a culture that has ALREADY pushed people into one corner of the room or the other. Your observations are of people that, from birth, have been told how and what to like.
I don't have a link atm, but there was a study done where they showed family members and strangers new babies, the gender of which was unknown. They told them the wrong gender and unsurprisingly people described females (who they were told were males) as "strong," "energetic," "big," etc while for the opposite case, males were called "sweet," "adorable," "soft." I mean this shit is happening before the baby has lived 24 hours.
Don't you think people could potentially behave very differently if they felt like certain decisions weren't gendered?
Really? Those are "problems" to you? Grow the fuck up and direct your energy towards actual suffering. A 21 year old crying because he was teased for playing with Barbies or some shit when he was 8 isn't suffering jack shit.
Again, grow up. I didn't downvote you before, but you've fucking earned it. You are really not contributing here.
1) Why not have an actual conversation and speak like adults? I mean otherwise why are we talking...
2) You actually responded to none of the reasoning and arguments. You just....diminished a person's suffering that you know nothing about, which leads me to...
3) You think the amount of suffering for many of these people is trivial? Are you aware of the numbers for individuals who don't fit the mold? Suicide, self-harm, aggression, depression...some of this suffering is certainly contributing to people acting a little crazy (re: Orlando shooter....and probably many others). This pain is not insignificant.
4) Is there some cutoff for acceptable amount of suffering before a problem is "legitimate"? We're not talking boo boos here. We're talking psychological trauma.
5) The solution costs nothing and needs nothing.....other than people simply stop telling kids that something is a "boy thing" or "girl thing." It's really not hard....just requires some people to listen to reality, accept it, and then move on.
6) Because I am an adult, with a masters degree, career, and vibrant life, I actually give literally zero fucks about fake Internet points.
Now I don't want to generalize too much about all violent, aggressive acts......but I think it is quite probable that, because of so many restrictions we have placed on ourselves, so many people just feel....out of place. Like they don't belong. Like they are just plain wrong.
Or, they are aware that there is nothing wrong with them and are enraged by oppressive (and arbitrary) norms and expectations.
In both of these situations, I can see how previously unstable people decide to do something awful.
It seems to be a strong theory now that the Orlando shooter was gay/bi/curious (?). He is a person (probably with several kinds of issues, emotional instability) who lost his place in the world. His religion shits on who he is as a person and could not, would not accept it. A man without a true tribe. Becomes aggressively homophobic to hide/self-convert/suppress. Then he rages.
Now, I don't want to be so snide as to say that I know this is actually what went on in Orlando specifically, but certainly these things have happened like this before. And it's not just gender/orientation. This kind of of abuse/trauma can be related to race/bullying/religion/socioeconomic status, and I'm sure others.
First, regarding point one. We are having an adult discussion. You don't get to apply high school debate rules to real life.
Second, I know that I ignored your argument. Not much reasoning went with it. I don't have a responsibility to recognize and nail my heart to everyone's hurt feelings.
Third, people that suffer PTSD, self-harm, suicide attempts/actual suicide, depression, so on and so forth, mostly stem from victims of actual child abuse, or being abused by SOs, or being ordered to kill someone, or anything else.
"I don't feel like my gender matches my genitalia" doesn't exactly fucking count here.
And good for you, apparently having a college education means you can adult so good, fellow adult. Good on you for your "life." It's super that you felt like bragging, as if that would put you head and shoulders over some theoretical neckbeard.
I just don't really know what else to say, fellow human.
I guess my only point is that genders don't actually match genitalia. That's a fabrication. Think of something you see people believing that you know isn't true. A religion you don't believe or whatever. And you look at them thinking, "How can they not see the fabrication they've been fed?" That's what I feel like right now.
And this fabrication does have real impacts that matter.
I'm sorry you can't see that. Good luck!
St3ven83 ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 03:11:13 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
So in a total hypothetical and gender neutral and equality society where every baby is neither a boy nor a girl untill they grow up. In this theory. You think the majority would not match up with the birth sex once given a choice?
Because if you're arguing it's not natural. That's a bold claim friend.
Like. If that stat of 0.3% of the population is trans. That means you are saying at least 47.8% of the population has been suppressed by our culture.
I'm all for the nature vs nurture argument. But this is just a bit extreme.
No, what I'm saying is that there just aren't genders. They are our collective imagination (subject to all kinds of differences among different humans). By the way you are talking, I think you are still misunderstanding that (no antagonism intended). When you say things like "until they grow up" and "not match up with," it implies that people WOULD "choose" a gender eventually and that there is some correct match to be made.
I think people wouldn't think about it.
There wouldn't be behavioural expectations that differ between the SEXES (which are pretty biologically firm....although still with exceptions (re: XXY, etc))
And I think that, regardless of how much we try to fit a square peg into a round hole, people really ARE genderless. Almost everyone feels this when they don't perfectly match these two restrictive gender "profiles." When a man is particularly expressive with emotions or when a woman doesn't enjoy doting on all of the aspects of her physical appearance. There are probably thousands more examples.
Would some (maybe even many) men still be super masculine dude warriors? Sure. And they should be proud of who they are. But there would probably be more dudes wearing nail polish and sipping Cosmos than there are now too. And does that actually matter? At all?
Because what is a "boy" other than a collection of expectations about his life? What kind of clothes to wear. What kind of behaviors he can express. What kind of emotions he's allowed to feel. Hell, even what alcoholic drinks are acceptable. If you don't arbitrarily enforce those standards, what is left? A male, free to be as he would like.
Edit: For the record, I actually don't think it matters to use normal English here. Call him a boy. But like I said elsewhere, just let boy mean more than it is currently. Let him get the pink hat at the store.
That's what downvotes are for! But that's okay. You do you. If you are curious about the philosophy behind the anti-gendering movement, you should look into the postmodernists, and especially Judith Butler.
tslime ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 03:33:53 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I have an understanding already thanks, it's the kids stuff I'm not convinced about.
Mere blabbering of spoiled brats who have it to well and live in a world which is at a 90 degree angle with realism, the only thing you achieve by giving attention is validating their baseless crying.
I love the way most women assume when a baby with a penis is born that it's a rapist.
jexmex ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 07:12:12 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
2edgy4me
Yoayo112 ยท -21 points ยท Posted at 17:39:22 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
There is a big difference between ones genetic biological sex, and the conscious understanding to identify as something different than what society may "assume".
People can still put on a survey that they're transgender, not that they're out. The same goes for homosexuality surveys. It doesn't ask whether you're out. It asks how you identify.
That doesn't really answer the question. Obviously if you've not transitioned / come out in any way then you're likely to fill yourself in as cis even in an anonymous survey. It's not a perfect society where internalized transphobia never reals
Even in the days of rampant homophobia, surveys existed to identify yourself as LGBT. Back in the day, Kinsey's surveys came up with about 10%. That's even higher than the current percentage of around 5%. So clearly, people will say they're a sexual minority on an anonymous survey. And there's people like this. So yes, even if you're in the closet, you can still identify as trans and put a checkmark next to your name on an anonymous survey.
These surveys also don't include transtrender praxigender treekin from tumblr.
Even if there were twice the amount of transpeople in the world, that would still only be 0.6%. Not nearly enough to warrant not calling a baby a boy or a girl for fear of triggering it.
That's fine. I agree. Make the assumption. But don't make your little boy feel like shit when he wants to role play his favorite Disney movie with you and chooses to be Belle. Or when your little girl wants to wear shorts and a t-shirt instead of that frilly dress.
As they decide what they want, let it happen (strictly talking about "gendered" choices....obviously not every choice).
If that happens in the first place. But most parents in the western world let their kids grow through their awkward, experimental phases without filling their heads with gender confusion, like that trans kid on YouTube whose SJW mom made a point to vlog giving her kid estrogen for the whole world to see.
And exactly why is it okay to expect a kid to understand sexuality and make sexual decisions if they can't remotely consent to sex?
I'm sure there are some crazy parents on the opposite side of the spectrum, pushing crazy ideas into their children's heads.
But if I'm arguing to let the kids decide, what would make you think my argument would relate to parents are so.ehow pushing opposite genders on the child?
Now, as far as hormones go, I am open to discussion about that... I don't know too much about children taking hormones or hormone blockers, and so won't form a strong opinion. I'll let the medical establishment decide that. Certainly though, no one should be making kids transition. That's scary...
Yes this does make me feel.....uneasy. But I don't understand the medicine and psychology of it all enough to have a strong opinion on that. And I'm sure each situation has its own specific details.
But in a free society, I think it should be left to the family, their doctor, and a child psychologist.....not to the uninformed judgements of a bunch of random people who have never had a meaningful connection with a queer person.
You provided child - raising directives. I offered reserved Thanks.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:17:28 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
boy
[boi]
NOUN
a male child or young man:
male
[meyl]
NOUN
a person bearing an X and Y chromosome pair in the cell nuclei and normally having a penis, scrotum, and testicles, and developing hair on the face at adolescence; a boy or man.
I gave birth to a baby with a penis two years ago. The child wore gender neutral clothing for a while, and then clothing that I (lacking a penis), would also wear (like things supporting the sports teams I like, and things I found rad). Now all he wants to play with are his cars, dinosaurs, and trains. Did I do something wrong?
Oh wait. He also has a kitchen because he's been obsessed with wanting to cook like Mama and Dada. And he has a Dorothy the Dinosaur (from the Wiggles) that he knows acts different from his other dinosaurs. She "tee hee hees" while the others roar. And he loves taking care of baby dolls.
I'm sure I'm still doing something wrong since I've labeled my kid a male before he even understands the differences in genders. Oh well. Hopefully it doesn't bite me in the ass.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 17:48:26 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I gave birth to a baby with a penis boy two years ago
Saved comment
[deleted] ยท 83 points ยท Posted at 00:45:10 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
My cousin gave birth a few months ago and announced it to Facebook with a "I have a baby with a penis".
DolphinSweater ยท 48 points ยท Posted at 06:53:40 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I mean, that kinda sounds like something I would write. Not in a gender neutral bullshit kinda way, but just as a general statement of fact. It sounds pretty funny.
[deleted] ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 08:29:01 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
It was definitely gender neutral, not allowed to be referred to as 'son', it's 'offspring' or 'child '. Nothing humerous about it, unfortunately.
She has always been interested in gender neutral/fluid. She has "it" in blue dresses as often as pink shorts and picked the gender neutral name "Ashley".
Agent_023 ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 08:41:14 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Ashley is gender neutral?
Renzolol ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 10:08:15 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I knew male and female Ashley's in school.
When mocking the boys it was a girls name. When mocking the girls it was a boys name.
Good times.
apocoluster ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 14:30:16 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Ash for Army of Darkness/Evil Dead was an Ashley
steelbeamsdankmemes ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:03:19 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Name's Ash, housewares.
Ghstfce ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 14:20:10 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The lead character in Vagrant Story is named Ashley Riot.
Tak_Jaehon ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:42:16 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
(Amazing game, and he was a great protagonist)
Ghstfce ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:03:58 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Totally. I loved that game. I remember actually getting the huge spiked mace from the minotaur boss. It wrecked face
Tak_Jaehon ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 02:41:43 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Such a great early game weapon. Now I'm gonna have to redownload that damn emulator...
duckshoe2 ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 13:48:15 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Sort of. Ashley Wilkes is a cis male character in Gone with the Wind. On the other hand he's portrayed as intellectual, thoughtful, and distinctly less macho than Rhett Butler, so there's plenty of thesis material on antebellum gender roles.
LuluRex ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 16:08:04 on August 9, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Just curious,how does your cousin refer to her baby? "He"? "She"? "It"? or something else?
NancyHicks-Gribble ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 13:18:27 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
It is your birthday.
RiverSongTheDM ยท 18 points ยท Posted at 01:17:58 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I quit. This world makes me sad that I live on this planet
motez23 ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 05:19:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Could be a joke
WhuddaWhat ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 04:49:40 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm torn. My knee-jerk reaction requires I downvote. But I want to upvote you for having shared.
PowerPeels ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 11:08:24 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Looks like it's time to let go of some family members
Silvystreak ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 05:40:38 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Time to lose a cousin
Uncle_Paul_Hargis ยท 193 points ยท Posted at 22:38:28 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
My 10 week old human child was born with a penis... however he's too busy trying to learn how to balance his cranium on top of his tiny body to inform me of his correct gender identity... We're not quite sure what to do...
IDespiseTheLetterG ยท 123 points ยท Posted at 23:59:57 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
He? His? Fucking pretend that you aren't scum if it makes you feel better.
Uncle_Paul_Hargis ยท 49 points ยท Posted at 00:30:30 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Damn me and my male oppressive pronoun usage!
powertripp82 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:08:10 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Oh god, Uncle Paul has a human child of his own!
Uncle Paul is 53 years young, he'll be 54 in maaaach
Shame about all those tattletales you've had to deal with throughout your life
Uncle_Paul_Hargis ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 15:13:21 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
They're all LIAHS! I didn't do Nut'n!
Icon_Crash ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 11:59:20 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm sure you're quite sure what to do Uncle Paul... take a picture to remember the day you spilled the paint.
Mister_Kurtz ยท 581 points ยท Posted at 17:51:16 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I love how when a woman gives birth to a child they automatically assume she's a mother.
Cactrot ยท 197 points ยท Posted at 22:10:12 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
How dare you assume the mother is a she
WhyteLivesMatter ยท 19 points ยท Posted at 14:36:47 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
TRIGGERED
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 22:24:08 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Pretty sure that if they didn't want to be called she they would also not want to be called a mother.
DarthJones1 ยท 64 points ยท Posted at 19:44:10 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
What if zhe wants to be a father? You didn't think about that you cis scum.
ki11bunny ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 02:11:08 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The funny thing is, in any other circumstance, you might have had a point there. Except my boss is a woman, I was a chick in the 40's, I hate everyone equally, and there's no one alive who can comprehend my sexual preference!
So in other words darthjones1, ch-ch-ch-check your privilege.
Tibetzz ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 02:22:36 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Bitches love cannons.
twystoffer ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 03:07:15 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4tQsOtw5G0
5th_Law_of_Robotics ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 15:00:25 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I hate how people assume that just because you don't have any kids and aren't a woman you can't identify as a mom.
As a childless non-female mother I am deeply offended by this.
hamfraigaar ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 05:11:33 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I love when someone makes a comment on Reddit people automatically assume they have a Reddit account
Transgendered_Kitten ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 16:42:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I love how when someone dies people automatically assume they are dead.
Mister_Kurtz ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 16:43:33 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Touche
TotesMessenger ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:15:18 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:
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uniquememerinos ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 14:28:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Leave the site, losers.
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 16:12:10 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
They cant, they feed on being offended.
wassuphaters777 ยท -9 points ยท Posted at 16:41:59 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
the only thing funnier than SRS getting offended is ppl getting offended at SRS and not realizing their hypocrisy
EDIT: downvoters see username ok finger sign emoji
Cine11 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 02:40:19 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Incredibly stupid people are offensive because of what a waste of education and resources they are. That's why SRS is offensive.
wassuphaters777 ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 03:17:31 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
and you get offended by that?? geez guess ppl are getting "too offended" these days
batchyoce ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 12:25:36 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Nobody gives a shit about SRS, nobody get offended by SRS, people want SRS to leave because they are parasites.
[deleted] ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 16:50:03 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Why is it that a SRS alt account is always there to write this comment.
wassuphaters777 ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 17:18:29 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
i've never even posted on SRS bc it's a shithole. there's not a single post in my comment history from SRS and i'm not subbed?
i just find it ironic that for every person bitching about PC culture and "people too offended these days" they fail to realize that their own "safe spaces" exist and their own hypocrisy.
make any accusation you want about what my account is... but you'll have trouble denying that fact
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:34:46 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Sorry for presuming, if im wrong but checking your comment history, you have similar talking points as them. While you are correct that both sides get offended, the thing is that one is actively looking for material to be offended, even when there is none and the other is pissed because they are being tone policed like they are children.
[deleted] ยท -9 points ยท Posted at 17:53:05 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:12:43 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
Seeing you didnt accept my apology just reassures me that i was right and you are SRS-ers alt account.
[deleted] ยท -5 points ยท Posted at 20:15:41 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
[deleted]
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 20:23:24 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Riiiiight. I am a mature and a empathic person thats why im not a SJW. Anyways cheers to you too.
StrongStyleSavior ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 20:54:15 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
lol
Il128 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 20:13:52 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
They tried https://www.imzy.com/ but were really unhappy and left it in droves. Seems they need to hate to be happy. Shocking isn't it.
Transgendered_Kitten ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 16:41:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
TRIGGERED !!!!
[deleted] ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 02:23:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I love how this is a perfect satire of the post because it literally does mean she's a mother.
lirenotliar ยท 37 points ยท Posted at 06:15:11 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
there is also a test for sexual orientation for men. the test is watching different types of porn and see what gets them the most erect.
after taking the test myself, i was surprised and felt that i had to tell my parents. the conversation went like this.
me: mom, dad...
mom: yes son?
dad: what is it, junior?
me...i'm a lesbian
[deleted] ยท 94 points ยท Posted at 17:26:07 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
ummm... relevant
jWalwyn ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 09:58:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Relevant Monty Python
[deleted] ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 02:24:22 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Good thing young girls and boys develop in exactly the same way with exactly the same body chemistry!!!
Rhode_Rogue ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 03:50:03 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I also love that most people have that basic level of common sense. Gender Dysphoria is the exception, not the rule.
[deleted] ยท 65 points ยท Posted at 19:05:03 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I love it too, because statistically speaking, it is and always will be a boy. Why would I assume otherwise, trans people consist of 0.3% of the population. Not assuming that it will be a boy, makes less sense than just assuming it will be autistic.
neoprenewedgie ยท 29 points ยท Posted at 19:49:38 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I question that statistic. That means one out of every 300 people is trans? That seems really high.
[deleted] ยท 34 points ยท Posted at 20:08:33 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Sorry, I meant 0.03% I think.
Edit: Nope, it is 0.3, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_demographics_of_the_United_States
neoprenewedgie ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 21:12:05 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'll accept that the reported statistic is correct. However, I still believe the estimate to be high, as a result of people wanting to be "cooler" when surveyed. (It works both ways - closeted people may be more likely to falsely identify themselves as straight, but it someone is willing to report being LGBT I think they are more likely exaggerate their trans feelings. I am pulling my data out of my ass, but it still sounds reasonable to me.)
[deleted] ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 21:35:52 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You are probably correct. I just know this to be the "accepted" percentage, and I was trying to make a point. Even with this probably over exaggerated number, assuming your boy is a "boy" is still correct 99+ times out of 100.
neoprenewedgie ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 23:22:09 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Oh I completely agree with you. As soon as you're at 99%, or even 97-98%, I think it's safe to make general assumptions.
gwtkof ยท 32 points ยท Posted at 21:57:37 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm trans and being trans is not cool its terrifying. It doesn't make you popular just a target. Google "transwoman killed" or something to that effect.
Katlima ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:14:26 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm sure it's not and how it can be scary, even if only thinking about the general opinion of people I know. I can see however, that some kind of people may come up with "stories" to make themselves more interesting even though they are not affected at all. Considering the really small number of people that actually ARE trans, the topic has gained a lot of attention. But with the good things attention brings, it always brings people who are after the attention itself more than anything else.
IDespiseTheLetterG ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 00:02:13 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah but people also talk about wanting to "take the fight to the Muslims" and shit like that because they think they're cool and brave. People don't know what things are like until they truly experience it.
gwtkof ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 01:50:13 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That's a bad analogy. A better analogy would be people wanting to be Muslim for the attention.
artist_101 ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 02:46:58 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The amount of willful ignorance about trans people in this thread is astounding. Yes, let's just pretend non-trans people report being trans to be cool even though coming out as trans is literally dangerous.
Also, the assumption that all genderqueer and trans people don't gender their children is just playing into preconceived and incorrect notions.
You all (minus u/gwtkof) ought to be ashamed of yourselves. Please learn about the actual trans experience before you go off spouting your mouths.
neoprenewedgie ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 04:35:26 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I think you miss my point. I agree with you that a non-trans person claiming to be trans trivializes the actual trans person. But I absolutely believe it happens. It's like the college girls who kissed each other at a frat party who then go around claiming to be bi to make them appear more edgy. It's wrong and insensitive, but it does happen.
And also keep in mind that when it comes to surveys, no one is actually "coming out" as trans. It's an anonymous answer on a survey so it is a safe place where they can say whatever they want - whether or not its true - without any consequences.
gwtkof ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 04:54:32 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
if they're saying it without any consequences then it follows that they're not getting the social benefits you describe.
neoprenewedgie ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 05:25:03 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
But they are "helping the cause." Most minority groups benefit from over-representation: the greater the number of perceived people in the group, the more likely the group will be listened to. And not to beat a dead horse - I'm not saying this some huge conspiracy or this kind of stuff is rampant. I'm simply exploring "what ifs."
croana ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 09:25:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Seriously, being trans is a stupidly difficult thing to be. You put way too much thought into what people might do for some sort of intangible benefit, where actually I'd say it's more likely that people who have trans friends would say, "I'm not trans and thank goodness, because it's so hard to work through." Do you say you need a wheelchair or have diabetes because you have friends who do, and you think they're underrepresented?
oss_spy ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 13:44:46 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You've never been to tumblr then. Some circles will ostracize you if you aren't some sort of oppressed
neoprenewedgie ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 13:04:42 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
People with diabetes or in wheelchairs aren't a repressed minority.
Matsarj ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:36:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The diabetes/wheelchair argument seems silly. I think being trans probably does have a cool/edgy connotation attached to it that having diabetes/being in a wheelchair doesnt.
croana ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 17:44:25 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
My point is that people who actually have trans friends don't really see it as being cool or edgy. It's just a part of life. It might seem different to you, because it's something outside of your daily experience. That's why I used the analogy, to put it in a more easily understandable context.
Edit: Actually implying that it's somehow cool comes off as a bit condescending, which is why I guess is why polite people would avoid making a big deal about it in the first place. To use another analogy, it would be like telling people about how many [insert: race/sexual orientation/ethnicity] friends you have to show how [pick one: cultured/accepting/well-rounded/worldly] you are.
I realize as I'm typing this that I'm trying to explain cultural subtlety on reddit. So apologies if my message isn't coming across. This is actually a really nuanced discussion that happens best in person, preferably with alcohol or something similar to help ease the conversation.
beeasaurusrex ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:59:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Not even remotely as frequently. Being transgender and being bisexual are not similar in the least. Nobody thinks you're cool or edgy or special for being trans. It's more embarrassing and hard to admit than anything else.
MrTimSearle ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:17:02 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Bit of an assumption that we ALL should be ashamed of ourselves :-/
spectralrays ยท -10 points ยท Posted at 00:15:45 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
So why don't your people en large accept sympathy because you're doing the best you can with a disorder?
Your people are asking not only for acceptance as normal, but to be treated as a special and protected class.
Edit: It's okay to not be normal. You guys need as much help as you can get. It's literally recognized in the medical community that your gender dysphoria has no effective psychological treatment, and that gender/sexual reassignment is the best available solution.
gwtkof ยท 12 points ยท Posted at 01:49:35 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Were not a homogenous group that I can speak for. The best I can do is to say that most trans people aren't asking for extra rights, we're just asking for people to not treat us like shit and to be allowed to take jobs we can do, instead of being unemployed through discrimination and getting jumped on the street.
Jesus__H_Christ ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 02:24:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You already have that right by simply being human. What you are asking for is acceptance, and that can't be legislated.
gwtkof ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 02:45:59 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That's true but irrelevant. If the main point were true then we could stop accepting you since it's fine.
neoprenewedgie ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:27:03 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The .3% number comes from a possibly flawed study based on a small sample size and a lot of "statistical gymnastics." However, a more recent, larger study shows the number as .6% - so that fits in with the opinion of those who feel the trans community is still under-reported. That same study said that .8% of Californians are Trans. I live in Los Angeles, a pretty progressive part of the state. I don't know any openly trans people; I probably know somebody who knows somebody who is open or closeted trans, but 1 out of 125 people still sounds high. We need more independent research studies (plural, so they can compare results) before we'll have an accurate number - whether it's higher or lower than the current belief of .3%.
DickyMcDoodle ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:48:33 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Not all trans peeps are "out" or pursue any change for whatever reason. Before it was acceptable most people stayed quiet about it because they didn't wanna be dead etc.
BTW I have no opinion on whether this stat is correct or whatever, this is just a possible explanation.
Kendarlington ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 21:01:02 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
It will depend on how the information was obtained and how questions were worded. You might be more willing to respond to "Do you identify as a different gender than your biological sex?" than "Do you consider yourself transgender?" or something like that
Rain_Near_Ranier ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 02:29:36 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
No, one out of every 333.333. It's three people in 1000.
Chilton82 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:34:01 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Where I live it doesn't seem that high at all.
GuildedCasket ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 14:53:48 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
There are far more trans or otherwise gender non-conforming people than we realize, mostly because it is very, very difficult and potentially dangerous for so many trans people to be out in the current political climate in most places. That number is probably artificially low at this point as well.
Kvothealar ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 16:29:45 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Sounds good to me.
I personally know 8 trans people and I'm not active in the LGBT community.
In my high school class (250 people) there was a trans person.
At my university (5000 people) there are about 15 trans people.
beeasaurusrex ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 06:57:58 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
There's a lot more of us than most people realize. Not everyone is passable or tries to pass as cisgender, so most people assume we're really ugly examples of our AAB gender or don't realize we're transgender at all. It's a sucky way to live.
DominoNo- ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 07:30:27 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Could be any of the other thousand tumblr genders!
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 12:30:14 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Those don't have anything to do with gender, biologically or mentally. This makes me want to die.
hockey7468 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:56:21 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Are these real people who think this is a gender?
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 14:59:48 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
AndThatIsWhyIDrink ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 10:59:06 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Currently that's correct.
The NHS in the UK has recently seen a rise in transgender individuals coming forwards for treatment by 4000% however.
This movement is only just getting started.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 12:32:44 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Ok, I'll start assuming every baby will eventually sexually identify as trans, because feelings.
AndThatIsWhyIDrink ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 12:37:39 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Where the fuck did I say that? Spastic.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 13:09:34 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That's ableism.
AndThatIsWhyIDrink ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 13:13:00 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
So? I didn't fucking say anything SJW you ignorant Jew. I just pointed out how fucking fast the problem is growing.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:14:58 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Oh boy, the edge.
AndThatIsWhyIDrink ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:24:45 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Now who's an SJW?
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:29:58 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Does that stand for super Jew wizard?
AndThatIsWhyIDrink ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 13:33:01 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Stupid Jewish Wanker.
TitsAndWhiskey ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:21:31 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Single Jewish Woman, you sexist pig!
Artifex75 ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 03:27:26 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Doctors will begin announcing facts rather than gender at birth.
"This recently born human has a penis and testicles . Make of that what you wish. "
yousername ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 05:52:44 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I wish there was a place where I can go and meet people like this and hit them with a stick and leave.
neoprenewedgie ยท 55 points ยท Posted at 17:28:38 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Has the whole world gone crazy, or is this just a U.S. thing? I want to know if I should leave the country or if I have to get off the entire planet.
jesuschristonacamel ยท 30 points ยท Posted at 19:43:57 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I've seen schoolmates go study liberal arts degrees in the US, and their posts on Facebook make me worry for my own country. The last thing we need in the middle of all the shit we're working through as a country right now is these idiots adding more problems on our plates. Problems that don't even exist in our part of the world sometimes.
kathartik ยท 34 points ยท Posted at 20:06:22 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
FTFY
they're making up problems for no reason except to be angry about something.
brianna20 ยท 16 points ยท Posted at 20:55:04 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
It's so ridiculous. People just want to complain about anything now a days. This is why I don't talk to most people.
DialsMavis ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 02:47:32 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Yes...it's by choice you don't.
Sturgeon_Genital ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 01:57:54 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Nowadays
motion_lotion ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 03:05:04 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Those are the people you cut out of your lives. Don't let them ruin the rest of people for you, just ignore the cancerous ones.
Icon_Crash ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 12:04:25 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I think all righthtinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary, decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired.
chaun2 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 06:19:50 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Monty python predicted this in Meaning of Life, so I say we blame GB
motion_lotion ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 03:03:38 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm hoping this strain of crazy is specific to the US, but I have my doubts.
ezhikov ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 21:59:06 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Same in Russia, so, i think, most of the World.
LameDuckySmith ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 02:37:12 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Seeing as Scandinavia has gender free preschools it's definitely not just a US thing
Nocturnalized ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 05:43:30 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Hold it right there!
Do not lump in Norway and Denmark with the crazy Swedes. Please.
thetarget3 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:36:55 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Sweden does. Not all of Scandinavia.
LameDuckySmith ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:39:59 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Finland sends people to jail for defending their house too aggressively so it's basically all of Scandinavia that's been breached by this SJW crap
thetarget3 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:36:35 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Finland isn't even in Scandinavia mate.
LameDuckySmith ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:52:49 on August 5, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I knew that. I pulled a stupid
DickyMcDoodle ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 02:42:49 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Australia - just as bad.
callmemrpenis ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 02:42:05 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Just a us thing mate. At least not an eu thing thank fsm.
Imalwaysneverthere ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 04:29:15 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
It's okay everybody. Let's all smoke Itsaboy cigars and calm the fuck down.
I_would_kill_you ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 05:01:11 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Does this only happen in America? This need for "fighting the power" on social media when the "power" is gender, sex, the penis, etc.
I realize that this is a bad example in that the person is a right fucking moron, but even slightly more intelligent people are doing this. But only, it seems, in the States. But maybe that's only because I don't subscribe to the foreign language counterparts of subs like this one...
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 21:50:54 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
America has 300 million people. Things like this seem more likely to happen in America, but it's just because there are so many people.
Also I think your right that language plays a large part. You don't hear about these things as often from Europe, for example, because not all of Europe speaks English. If you're only watching news in English then it'll really be skewed towards America. The EU has 500 million people, but something like only 15% of them natively speak English. 80% of people in America speak English as a first language. Native language is important because most people use social media in their native language. So while all this is likely happening in Europe as well, it's spread out over several languages and countries so you don't necessarily hear about it has often.
I_would_kill_you ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 04:30:44 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Where I live in good ol' yerp I don't hear about this sort of thing from people I know or posts that I didn't ask to see on Facebook, for example. It's not that women are especially free or oppressed that there's no "need" for fighting against the terror that is male genitalia; it's more like people seem to have other things to worry about HOLY SHIT:
Having time to complain about the oppression of the cock and say things like "that baby isn't a boy just because it's a boy" is privilege. Oh I'm tickled by the notion.
Thank you for your thoughtful response. I'm glad that where I live I don't have to hear about this sort of thing in social media or in life, even if it's just an awareness issue and not an... "existence" issue.
PowerPeels ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 11:12:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Ive been wondering the same thing. Basically only americans spout this bullshit, just like those gender neutral bathrooms. (Fyi who gives a fuck where you take a dump, as long as you close the stall and dont make any eye contact in the restroom. Basic rules.)
This stuff has got to stop before it reaches the rest of the world.
RockDaHouse690 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 10:36:12 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
They seem slightly more intelligent because they are saying these things with confidence, but theyre all the same brand of dipshit.
[deleted] ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 19:40:36 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That is indeed the technical definition.
[deleted] ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 21:11:26 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
And we have a winner - step on up and collect the Mo-Mo of the week award
Laundrymango ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 07:25:33 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Just admit you wanted a girl ffs.
premium_grade ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 08:54:41 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The NEW dumb.
duckshoe2 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 13:38:41 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Man goes to the doctor, "Doc, I've been shot in the leg with an arrow!" "Let's not jump to conclusions, I need to run some tests..."
duckshoe2 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 13:41:30 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
"My cousin is pregnant, and I can't wait to find out if it's a boy or a girl, so I'll know whether I'm an uncle or an aunt..." - Gracie Allen.
[deleted] ยท 13 points ยท Posted at 18:31:32 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I was born a manspreading rapist.
I got better.
spectralrays ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 00:20:01 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I looked at a pretty girl today. A-am I a rapist?
DickyMcDoodle ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 02:50:21 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Were you oppressing her? Or did you have a good reason - like she was on fire and you were genuinely concerned?
ChrisTheCoolBean ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 04:04:57 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
How DARE you say that she was on fire!!!
DickyMcDoodle ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 07:56:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Oh shit. I now realise that my comment could have been misconstrued as a sexist judgement of her looks - that she was hot. I'm ashamed of myself so often. Apologies.
spectralrays ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 09:03:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Um, I glanced at her boobs a little.
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 01:08:54 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You disgust me
breathewater ยท 6 points ยท Posted at 03:22:00 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I mean, babies have no sense of gender identity. They don't really care if they're called a boy or a girl or a squirrel.
[deleted] ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 17:45:47 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That's usually a good indicator, but only useful to those who procreate.
neoprenewedgie ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 18:26:34 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I haven't procreated but I still find it useful.
2high2makeAusername ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 12:37:41 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
Someone please explain to me how something like your sexuality (which is a concept) is something that you're born with and cannot change.. But something like your gender (which is literally coded into your dna) is something that can be "wrong" and something you can decide to change.
Edit: I see people are down voting but no one is actually replying with a point. If you have an opinion on what im saying I want to hear it.
Yoayo112 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 16:20:08 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
Hey man, I came here to say the same thing. And my post currently has about 22 downvotes... I think this thread is the real facepalm..
2high2makeAusername ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 04:30:34 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The world is upside down man, men are women and women are men and Donald trump might be president. I never expected to be one of those people who are like "back in my day blah blah blah..." But im only 24 and im like "wtf happened to this place?"
TitsAndWhiskey ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 17:24:11 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Hell of a point. I'm stealing this.
2high2makeAusername ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 04:36:31 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
If you find an answer let me know
DeathByPianos ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:29:52 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The idea (not necessarily stating my own personal opinion here people) is that your gender is assigned to you, and this assigned gender may not actually match up with the gender of your brain.
2high2makeAusername ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 04:27:21 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I mean I get that, but how can your gender be wrong if it's based literally on which chromosomes you receive? If you have a male chromosome and male genitals then how can your brain be female? That sounds more like there's something wrong with your brain than there's something wrong with your body. And just to be clear im not like anti-homosexual, I just think it's more nurture than nature.
Danielgonzalez77 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 05:36:58 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
DID YOU JUST ASSUME THE BABIES GENDER!!!
AthiestLibNinja ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 07:02:15 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Triple Facepalm
Violet-Amber ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 07:09:08 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
So is the post saying how people jump to the conclusion the child is male/female solely on the external physical aspects and not double checking the gametic make-up (XX vs XY), or is the post about people that feel that we shouldn't be trying to imprint our expectations of gender roles based on the child's biological sex?
tieberion ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 03:32:38 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Seriously, is that fucking real, and if so, has our society really gone that far down the shitter
RockDaHouse690 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 10:29:12 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Yes, because refusing to call your child anything but neutral pronouns not only until they can speak, but that they can identify themselves as a specific gender wont fuck them up more than just calling a boy a boy and a girl a girl.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 10:44:37 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
FUCK! I am starting to hate humanity!
Zymn ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:57:02 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
The wisdom and insight of Sir Thomas Moore rings true.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x98cE4QCrlk
jbakers ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 10:33:28 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm so glad this ridiculous gender nonsense is not a thing in Europe.
Mentioned_Videos ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 11:46:30 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Videos in this thread: Watch Playlist โถ
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AngelicWaffle ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 18:25:34 on September 11, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I like how people look at the sky and assume it's blue
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 17:38:59 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Most people? I'm pretty sure this person is the only one that believes it
Fermats_Last_Account ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 19:19:51 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
So you're saying that a baby with a penis isn't a boy?
MouthJob ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 17:52:55 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Are you saying that only this person "assumes when a baby is born with a penis it's a boy?"
thearss1 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 05:03:11 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
So I just going to trigger it. Sex is not the same thing as gender.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:06:50 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Robert_Grave ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 10:09:27 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Nope, but if you use them as interchangable terms you are right 99.99% of the time, its just the 0.01% that gets offended.
Gentleaxe ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 02:15:38 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'll tell you what shouldn't be allowed: this persons ability to procreate
hb2002 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 09:50:21 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Fuck these kind of people. The world is going to shit for sure
D-Hub36 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 03:55:46 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I can't tell how many of these posts / tweets are because most people are incredibly stupid or are overtly moronic.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 12:44:18 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Where are all these demented, fucktarded people coming from?
blockpro156 ยท -15 points ยท Posted at 22:42:52 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
Honestly I don't see what's wrong with this, if we're really moving towards equality then we should just raise kids as people, not as boys or girls, and let them figure the rest out for themselves.
Buying them "boy stuff" or "girl stuff" as soon as you see their penis (or lack thereof) is really dumb, and it's the definition of sexism.
This isn't even just about transgenders, even if a boy identifies as a boy, it's still bad that they're told that they're supposed to behave and dress a certain way just because they have a penis.
I get that in the current enviroment it's just not possible to avoid calling a boy a boy, using gender neutral terms for that long would simply be very impractical.
But I totally agree that we should be moving in a direction where someone's genitals don't affect the way that they're raised.
ButtsexEurope ยท 14 points ยท Posted at 01:12:36 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Not having gendered toys is fine. But that doesn't make the body any less male or female. Doesn't make the child any less of a boy or a girl.
Yes, let's raise them as humans. And as humans, they are sexually dimorphic. Boys pee standing up. Girls don't and need toilet paper.
noidentityattachment ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 19:21:14 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
google sex vs gender and stop pretending to know shit about the subject when you lack the most fundamental lingo pls
ButtsexEurope ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 19:38:03 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
/u/noidentityattachment, eh? Go back to tumblr.
noidentityattachment ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 20:05:53 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
srsly pls use google
PissedOffAngryGuy ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 23:41:55 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
What a trendy thought! Everything sucks and we're all outraged!
blockpro156 ยท -6 points ยท Posted at 23:45:09 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Wtf are you even saying?
PissedOffAngryGuy ยท 8 points ยท Posted at 00:05:57 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm saying honestly I don't see what's wrong with raising boys as "boys" and girls as "girls". But everyone nowadays needs something to fight against and we can't hurt anyone's feelings. Especially with this gender thing. Gender is a biological fact. If you have a penis, you're a boy. If you have a vagina you're a girl. If you have a penis and you wish you had a vagina, that's fine but don't try telling anyone you're a girl because you're not, you're a boy that wishes he was a girl
WhuddaWhat ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 00:38:30 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Being transgender seems like a disorder. Perhaps driven by hormonal imbalance or some other physiological driver. Our current best available treatment seems to be sex reassignment. For people to claim that all kids should be treated as a blank slate until such time they exhibit their status as it relates to this paricular malady is...lunacy. That's not to say that transgendered individuals should not get the same respect and priveleges as all individuals deserve. But the terms like "cis" are simply unnecessary. Just as there is no term for people without lupus, or crohn's.
Wheeeuu ยท -5 points ยท Posted at 00:30:46 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Seriously? Gender isn't biological, sex is biological. Gender is mental, sex is physical. I suggest you do some research because you're wrong. You're apart of the problem.
blockpro156 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 00:31:32 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
So what do you consider "raising them as boys"? Because my whole point was that there shouldn't be a difference in how they're raised, them being a boy shouldn't mean that they're raised in a different way.
"Biological facts" have nothing to do with this, there aren't many biological facts involved in our society's gender stereotypes.
oss_spy ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 13:48:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Women as a whole are weaker than men so there's that...
blockpro156 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 14:45:27 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
And why should that in any meaningful way influence the way that they're raised?
oss_spy ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 22:04:45 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Because I'm a sexist pig obviously
blockpro156 ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 23:42:34 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I never even implied anything like that, I just stated my opinion.
I don't see the point of insulting pretty much everybody in our society by calling them sexist, doesn't mean that there aren't some things that I think should be different.
oss_spy ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 00:14:28 on August 4, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You downvoted me for admitting my rampant sexism?
rosettastoned32 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 23:57:16 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
This. It isn't about Trans or sexual orientation. It's just accepting the reality that there isn't much inherently "boyish" or "girlish." You can see this obviously in differences between cultures. Male and female are biological, but gender expectations are clearly cultural.
I'm a man. Happy to have a penis. But I generally fit the "normal" female stereotype of gender. I'm proud of myself and see no reason to be particularly "masculine." And it has no negative bearing on my morality, mental health, or contribution to society.
Just let kids be kids. They'll feel more comfortable and confident....and it isn't going to make us all raging homosexuals and transsexuals.
spectralrays ยท 9 points ยท Posted at 00:25:53 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
No, wrong. The vast majority of people will, naturally, both match sex and gender, and prefer the opposite sex.
There's no give on the first point, but as a bi dude, I wish more people were flexible. Wishes are like assholes, though.
rosettastoned32 ยท -8 points ยท Posted at 00:47:08 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Oh really? "Naturally"? So then why do potentially homophobic men hold hands in many parts of Africa but many men here would find that unacceptable? Natural? There are no natural genders. It's like religion.....for many people, you end up being what's around you.
And remember, you are basing your assumptions off of a culture that has ALREADY pushed people into one corner of the room or the other. Your observations are of people that, from birth, have been told how and what to like.
I don't have a link atm, but there was a study done where they showed family members and strangers new babies, the gender of which was unknown. They told them the wrong gender and unsurprisingly people described females (who they were told were males) as "strong," "energetic," "big," etc while for the opposite case, males were called "sweet," "adorable," "soft." I mean this shit is happening before the baby has lived 24 hours.
Don't you think people could potentially behave very differently if they felt like certain decisions weren't gendered?
spectralrays ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 01:01:31 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Really? Those are "problems" to you? Grow the fuck up and direct your energy towards actual suffering. A 21 year old crying because he was teased for playing with Barbies or some shit when he was 8 isn't suffering jack shit.
Again, grow up. I didn't downvote you before, but you've fucking earned it. You are really not contributing here.
rosettastoned32 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:22:49 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
A couple of things...
1) Why not have an actual conversation and speak like adults? I mean otherwise why are we talking...
2) You actually responded to none of the reasoning and arguments. You just....diminished a person's suffering that you know nothing about, which leads me to...
3) You think the amount of suffering for many of these people is trivial? Are you aware of the numbers for individuals who don't fit the mold? Suicide, self-harm, aggression, depression...some of this suffering is certainly contributing to people acting a little crazy (re: Orlando shooter....and probably many others). This pain is not insignificant.
4) Is there some cutoff for acceptable amount of suffering before a problem is "legitimate"? We're not talking boo boos here. We're talking psychological trauma.
5) The solution costs nothing and needs nothing.....other than people simply stop telling kids that something is a "boy thing" or "girl thing." It's really not hard....just requires some people to listen to reality, accept it, and then move on.
6) Because I am an adult, with a masters degree, career, and vibrant life, I actually give literally zero fucks about fake Internet points.
WhuddaWhat ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 04:54:56 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Please expand on point 3 and how it ties to the Orlando shooter. I don't get it.
rosettastoned32 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 07:11:50 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Now I don't want to generalize too much about all violent, aggressive acts......but I think it is quite probable that, because of so many restrictions we have placed on ourselves, so many people just feel....out of place. Like they don't belong. Like they are just plain wrong.
Or, they are aware that there is nothing wrong with them and are enraged by oppressive (and arbitrary) norms and expectations.
In both of these situations, I can see how previously unstable people decide to do something awful.
It seems to be a strong theory now that the Orlando shooter was gay/bi/curious (?). He is a person (probably with several kinds of issues, emotional instability) who lost his place in the world. His religion shits on who he is as a person and could not, would not accept it. A man without a true tribe. Becomes aggressively homophobic to hide/self-convert/suppress. Then he rages.
Now, I don't want to be so snide as to say that I know this is actually what went on in Orlando specifically, but certainly these things have happened like this before. And it's not just gender/orientation. This kind of of abuse/trauma can be related to race/bullying/religion/socioeconomic status, and I'm sure others.
spectralrays ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 01:41:07 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
First, regarding point one. We are having an adult discussion. You don't get to apply high school debate rules to real life.
Second, I know that I ignored your argument. Not much reasoning went with it. I don't have a responsibility to recognize and nail my heart to everyone's hurt feelings.
Third, people that suffer PTSD, self-harm, suicide attempts/actual suicide, depression, so on and so forth, mostly stem from victims of actual child abuse, or being abused by SOs, or being ordered to kill someone, or anything else.
"I don't feel like my gender matches my genitalia" doesn't exactly fucking count here.
And good for you, apparently having a college education means you can adult so good, fellow adult. Good on you for your "life." It's super that you felt like bragging, as if that would put you head and shoulders over some theoretical neckbeard.
rosettastoned32 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 01:53:53 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I just don't really know what else to say, fellow human.
I guess my only point is that genders don't actually match genitalia. That's a fabrication. Think of something you see people believing that you know isn't true. A religion you don't believe or whatever. And you look at them thinking, "How can they not see the fabrication they've been fed?" That's what I feel like right now.
And this fabrication does have real impacts that matter.
I'm sorry you can't see that. Good luck!
St3ven83 ยท -2 points ยท Posted at 03:11:13 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
/iamverysmart with my masters degree too!
rosettastoned32 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 03:20:04 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Anything of value to add?
GiantJellyfishAttack ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 06:14:01 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
So in a total hypothetical and gender neutral and equality society where every baby is neither a boy nor a girl untill they grow up. In this theory. You think the majority would not match up with the birth sex once given a choice?
Because if you're arguing it's not natural. That's a bold claim friend.
Like. If that stat of 0.3% of the population is trans. That means you are saying at least 47.8% of the population has been suppressed by our culture.
I'm all for the nature vs nurture argument. But this is just a bit extreme.
rosettastoned32 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 06:56:57 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
No, what I'm saying is that there just aren't genders. They are our collective imagination (subject to all kinds of differences among different humans). By the way you are talking, I think you are still misunderstanding that (no antagonism intended). When you say things like "until they grow up" and "not match up with," it implies that people WOULD "choose" a gender eventually and that there is some correct match to be made.
I think people wouldn't think about it.
There wouldn't be behavioural expectations that differ between the SEXES (which are pretty biologically firm....although still with exceptions (re: XXY, etc))
And I think that, regardless of how much we try to fit a square peg into a round hole, people really ARE genderless. Almost everyone feels this when they don't perfectly match these two restrictive gender "profiles." When a man is particularly expressive with emotions or when a woman doesn't enjoy doting on all of the aspects of her physical appearance. There are probably thousands more examples.
Would some (maybe even many) men still be super masculine dude warriors? Sure. And they should be proud of who they are. But there would probably be more dudes wearing nail polish and sipping Cosmos than there are now too. And does that actually matter? At all?
ButtsexEurope ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 01:14:17 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
And how does not calling someone with a penis a boy help that?
rosettastoned32 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 01:25:05 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)*
Because what is a "boy" other than a collection of expectations about his life? What kind of clothes to wear. What kind of behaviors he can express. What kind of emotions he's allowed to feel. Hell, even what alcoholic drinks are acceptable. If you don't arbitrarily enforce those standards, what is left? A male, free to be as he would like.
Edit: For the record, I actually don't think it matters to use normal English here. Call him a boy. But like I said elsewhere, just let boy mean more than it is currently. Let him get the pink hat at the store.
ButtsexEurope ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 01:29:08 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
What if I told you it's possible to let a boy do what he wants and still be called a boy?
rosettastoned32 ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 01:33:00 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Are you reading what I'm saying? I literally said that.
WhuddaWhat ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 03:08:00 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You used multiple words. I'm not sure you said anything.
tslime ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:33:29 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Nonsense.
RetroMetropolitan ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 02:38:32 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
YOU SURE TOLD THEM.
tslime ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 02:50:16 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Well I'm not trying to convince them of anything, just registering my objection (informally now and by affadavit later)
RetroMetropolitan ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 03:22:11 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That's what downvotes are for! But that's okay. You do you. If you are curious about the philosophy behind the anti-gendering movement, you should look into the postmodernists, and especially Judith Butler.
tslime ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 03:33:53 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I have an understanding already thanks, it's the kids stuff I'm not convinced about.
noidentityattachment ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 19:19:59 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
suuuuuuureeeeee
tslime ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:32:35 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You don't know anything about gender and sexuality.
[deleted] ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 05:43:11 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
We really need another world war. Western spoilt brats have nothing to fucking worry about but this crap.
Robert_Grave ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 10:08:33 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
This comment exactly shows how we have forgotten that we should definetly try very hard to NOT have a world war.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 10:11:49 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You are right, however there is true suffering in the world and this small minded rubbish is infuriating.
Robert_Grave ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 11:52:20 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Mere blabbering of spoiled brats who have it to well and live in a world which is at a 90 degree angle with realism, the only thing you achieve by giving attention is validating their baseless crying.
Eben_MSY ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:22:28 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
"It's symbolic of his struggle against reality... "
Iamgoingtooffendyou ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 03:57:41 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I love the way most women assume when a baby with a penis is born that it's a rapist.
jexmex ยท 0 points ยท Posted at 07:12:12 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
2edgy4me
Yoayo112 ยท -21 points ยท Posted at 17:39:22 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
There is a big difference between ones genetic biological sex, and the conscious understanding to identify as something different than what society may "assume".
fivestarsacklunch ยท 10 points ยท Posted at 22:04:57 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
There it is.
Muffinizer1 ยท 15 points ยท Posted at 17:57:08 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
There's a 99.7% chance that they're the same, so it's a pretty safe assumption.
neoprenewedgie ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 18:25:22 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
And I would guess the percentage is even higher. Much, much higher.
WitherBones ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 20:51:35 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
No, theyre right. .3% identify as trans, so their 99.7% statistic is accurate.
flailing_uterus ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 06:12:10 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Hah why are you getting down voted, you legit stated a fact
WitherBones ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 06:37:34 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Because this is reddit, where the rules are made up, and the points don't matter.
Yoayo112 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 14:12:56 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Thats what im wondering...
trapper2530 ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 23:57:18 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Someone else said 0.03%. Either way it's very low.
WitherBones ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 05:05:46 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
They were incorrect and they said as much later in the thread.
DakMan3 ยท -3 points ยท Posted at 23:02:56 on August 2, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
And do we have the statistics on people that want to identify as trans but because of the fear of coming out?
WitherBones ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 05:06:45 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
No way to be sure that such a number exists or is even accurate.
ButtsexEurope ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 01:16:03 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
People can still put on a survey that they're transgender, not that they're out. The same goes for homosexuality surveys. It doesn't ask whether you're out. It asks how you identify.
noidentityattachment ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:24:49 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That doesn't really answer the question. Obviously if you've not transitioned / come out in any way then you're likely to fill yourself in as cis even in an anonymous survey. It's not a perfect society where internalized transphobia never reals
ButtsexEurope ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 19:37:21 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Even in the days of rampant homophobia, surveys existed to identify yourself as LGBT. Back in the day, Kinsey's surveys came up with about 10%. That's even higher than the current percentage of around 5%. So clearly, people will say they're a sexual minority on an anonymous survey. And there's people like this. So yes, even if you're in the closet, you can still identify as trans and put a checkmark next to your name on an anonymous survey.
These surveys also don't include transtrender praxigender treekin from tumblr.
Even if there were twice the amount of transpeople in the world, that would still only be 0.6%. Not nearly enough to warrant not calling a baby a boy or a girl for fear of triggering it.
rosettastoned32 ยท -6 points ยท Posted at 00:01:41 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
That's fine. I agree. Make the assumption. But don't make your little boy feel like shit when he wants to role play his favorite Disney movie with you and chooses to be Belle. Or when your little girl wants to wear shorts and a t-shirt instead of that frilly dress.
As they decide what they want, let it happen (strictly talking about "gendered" choices....obviously not every choice).
spectralrays ยท 5 points ยท Posted at 00:29:31 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
If that happens in the first place. But most parents in the western world let their kids grow through their awkward, experimental phases without filling their heads with gender confusion, like that trans kid on YouTube whose SJW mom made a point to vlog giving her kid estrogen for the whole world to see.
And exactly why is it okay to expect a kid to understand sexuality and make sexual decisions if they can't remotely consent to sex?
rosettastoned32 ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 00:50:56 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I'm sure there are some crazy parents on the opposite side of the spectrum, pushing crazy ideas into their children's heads.
But if I'm arguing to let the kids decide, what would make you think my argument would relate to parents are so.ehow pushing opposite genders on the child?
Now, as far as hormones go, I am open to discussion about that... I don't know too much about children taking hormones or hormone blockers, and so won't form a strong opinion. I'll let the medical establishment decide that. Certainly though, no one should be making kids transition. That's scary...
spectralrays ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 00:57:39 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Well at least we can agree on that part. What about any kids undergoing HT? People that can't consent deciding their permanent sexual identity.
rosettastoned32 ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 07:33:22 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Yes this does make me feel.....uneasy. But I don't understand the medicine and psychology of it all enough to have a strong opinion on that. And I'm sure each situation has its own specific details.
But in a free society, I think it should be left to the family, their doctor, and a child psychologist.....not to the uninformed judgements of a bunch of random people who have never had a meaningful connection with a queer person.
WhuddaWhat ยท 4 points ยท Posted at 00:24:14 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Thanks for the advice, I guess?
rosettastoned32 ยท -1 points ยท Posted at 00:40:27 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Not sure what you're going for here...
WhuddaWhat ยท 3 points ยท Posted at 00:48:13 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
You provided child - raising directives. I offered reserved Thanks.
[deleted] ยท 1 points ยท Posted at 15:17:28 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
YouMeAndSymmetry ยท -6 points ยท Posted at 08:19:01 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
I gave birth to a baby with a penis two years ago. The child wore gender neutral clothing for a while, and then clothing that I (lacking a penis), would also wear (like things supporting the sports teams I like, and things I found rad). Now all he wants to play with are his cars, dinosaurs, and trains. Did I do something wrong?
Oh wait. He also has a kitchen because he's been obsessed with wanting to cook like Mama and Dada. And he has a Dorothy the Dinosaur (from the Wiggles) that he knows acts different from his other dinosaurs. She "tee hee hees" while the others roar. And he loves taking care of baby dolls.
I'm sure I'm still doing something wrong since I've labeled my kid a male before he even understands the differences in genders. Oh well. Hopefully it doesn't bite me in the ass.
[deleted] ยท 2 points ยท Posted at 17:48:26 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
TeddyBongwater ยท -6 points ยท Posted at 06:21:28 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
A lot of phobia itt
RockDaHouse690 ยท 7 points ยท Posted at 10:40:25 on August 3, 2016 ยท (Permalink)
Yeah, fucking Idiot Phobia.